BloodHorse at the Breeders’ Cup 25 | Friday

I I welcome into another edition of Blood Horse at the Breeders

Cup. My name is Louis Ribeau.

Thanks for joining us. Hopefully you caught yesterday's

episode and you're planning on catching tomorrow's as well.

I'm alongside Carlos Morales from my head days, today, Cerro

Cinco, Agent 305 of course, and our guy Sean Collins who hangs

out with me every Monday on Blood Horse Monday when he's not

at the track. It's the only time if.

It's a rarity. Yeah, he's in the studio with me

and then he goes back to the track.

It's a whole thing. I know you pull me away from the

backside person just to come record a show every Monday and

then I go right back and I just, I just sleep in a stall there.

Have you thought about the idea of having the studio inside of

an install? That we have, actually.

Why have we not? We've actually thought.

About it, all the talk that we have on Blood Horse Monday about

the backdrops, which by the way, we have a great one here with

Delmar behind us, but I have not done 1 yet in a stall.

I think Carlos is on to something here, yeah.

Definitely. So we need to have a horse in

the stall with us. That would be even better.

Better it make it it make it more challenging, more

interesting. There it is.

The sad part is is I could probably find someone.

That's doing. Yeah, no doubt.

That's exactly right. But Carlos and Sean alongside

me, I'm Louis Rabo. Thanks for hanging out with us.

Just a little bit of a talk ahead of the races on Friday,

Carlos, as we get ready for that juvenile day, certainly we get

to see all of those best turf horses from Europe coming over.

We also want to find out who's going to be on that Oaks trail,

going to be on that Derby trail, going to make our three-year old

year interesting next year. What are you in particular

looking forward to on the card on Friday?

Definitely there's a lot of talent this Friday, not just the

local but those the international that have come

especially for the turf. A lot of the European horses,

especially from Apple Buy and Eden O'Brien, they look awesome

in the track. But that's something that we're

used to. You know every time that they

come for these big races, they always show up in their best

condition in the best performance, which is what we

are all expecting. So pick and choosing between all

the different horses is very tough.

But definitely if we see the bright side, we are able to see

one of the top feature starts, which is marvelous.

You know they like the Friday for the juveniles.

I agree though, it is marvelous. And frankly, you know, when,

when horses like and, and I was just, you know, we'll have,

we'll have excuse me, we'll have Frank Angstahn later in the

episode and I'm sure we'll get to this.

We'll talk turf racing with him. But the fact that Aidan O'Brien

keeps bringing on these horses and frankly, as 2 year olds get

a little better every year, it's a pretty remarkable thing.

But you mentioned Charlie Appleby, those kinds of

trainers. Andrew Balding will see his name

tomorrow as well. Lots of guys who are bringing

better and better EUR here. I love the force of competition

here, Sean. I think it's a fantastic thing

having to raise our game in the United States because frankly on

that side of things, less certainly, especially in

breeding and different things, less of an emphasis for us.

But there's no reason the quality can't get better on.

And we're really starting to raise our game on the turf now.

We've seen in recent years where the turf horses, I feel like

I've gotten better in the United States.

You have places like Kentucky Downs that are now offering a

lot of purse money to be running on the grass.

And so I think as we go forward, we're going to see more of an

emphasis on breeding grass horses here in the United

States, maybe going overseas looking for more grass horses to

bring over. And you see a guy like Steve

Asmussen each year that has a couple dirt horses with turf in

their pedigrees. So that way they can switch over

to the grass when it comes time time for the Kentucky Downs

meet. We see that with Obliteration,

who's in the Juvenile Turf Sprint today.

He started on the dirt. He won a Grade 3 on the dirt and

the Sanford Stakes, and now he's going to be running in the turf

in the Breeders Cup after a couple starts on the grass.

And so we're starting to see, I think, where we're getting

better turf forces here in the US.

Not to say that our turf forces were never any good, but when

these big Europeans come in, I feel like it's starting to

become a little bit more even. We have more of a shot to

potentially get them in these races more consistently.

And so we'll see whether or not that holds true today.

But I know the Europeans in these juvenile races, they're

pretty tough coming in here. So we'll have to wait and see

what happens. There, Yeah, we'll see that for

sure. I'm I'm fascinated by this

Carlos and I wanted to get your opinion on this much made of the

post position draw earlier in the week where we see precisely

in race eight in the juvenile Phillies in the 13 hole on the

outside we see Gestat in the juvenile turf and in race 10 at

the end of the card in the 14 hole as well.

The prevailing opinions that I've heard about those racing

races, Carlos, is that precise is just better than the rest of

the horses in the field. She's going to be fine.

Gestat we don't know. That seems to be kind of the

prevailing thought. Does the post position matter

that much to you? Because I was there in 2021,

order of Australia broke from the 14.

It was just fine in the mile at Keeneland.

What do you make of it? I think it varies depending on

the track that you're that you're running.

In the case we're talking about this one, very tight corners,

very short final stretch. So I think it does depends and

it does helps be as close as you can to the rail to make to run

the the less space or the less made meters or forelands.

So to get first to the to the finish line.

So to me it is it is important. It is it is heavy for precise to

be in sole motion the outside. But it's even worse for just

that to be like in the inside because what right in the brake

everybody's going to go to get the get the rail.

So this is the one that is going to If you don't have a good and

clean brake, you're in trouble. It's remarkable how many of the

top horses either drew the Rail Rebels, Romance, Fierce, this,

etcetera on Saturday and then on the outside for these juveniles

in these races as well. Less for a Ted Dolphy in the 8

or something like that. He'll be fine and he's breaking

from the seven. After a scratch, of course.

These kinds of things. But boy, in those turf races,

like you mentioned, the the the course is tight.

It's OK to say it just is. The only thing I pushed back on,

and hopefully I'll get into this with Frank later in the episode,

is I do think we underestimate because this is more of like a

7/7 and 1/2 half type of turf course.

You actually start about a little more than a 16th behind

the finish line. And so you do have a little bit

of time to make a maneuver by the first turn.

But you got to do work on that first turn like you just said,

especially if you're on the inside.

And so it will be interesting to see which one of which ones of

those will be able to pick up that way.

And you also have to remember one of the interesting parts

about this Breeders' Cup when you're looking at like the Aiden

O'Brien team, for example, there's no Ryan Moore this year.

He's out injured. Think of all the fantastic rides

that he has given saving, saving ground on the inside in the

Breeders Cup. We're not going to have him this

year. Can Christophe Sumiyan do the

same thing? I think he can.

He has the talent, he knows how to do it.

Obviously there's a challenge of the he haven't win the Breeders

Cup race since a long time, but that doesn't mean that he's not

capable of. He has been running excellent

lately. He has great rides because of

Ryan Moore being in in the in the outside right now.

He's recovering. Thankfully he had Christos

Semillon has taken the lead of this role with Bali Doyle, which

he he has so far. He has actually showed that he

was up to the up to the task. So I don't have any doubt that

he will put his best right in the best effort to get the best

opportunity to get the horse to the finish line first.

He does has the talent the the, the, the, the only question mark

will be will that talent will be work in this track.

That's the big question mark for me.

Now, Carlos, you probably more than anyone get around the

backstretch to talk to as many people.

You've been here all week now. I don't know, I think you might

have. Me fight, fight.

Third fight. Let's go third fight here at Del

Mar. But you, you've been here all

week, you've been going through the barns.

When we're looking specifically at the 2 year olds, is there

anything that you've heard from any of the connections, whether

it be, you know, this horse is doing really well or maybe it's

just a fun story that you've heard about the horse?

Anything that really stuck out to you about any of these

juveniles running this week? Yes, let's go with the ladies

first, Lenny Lou, I know she's a Florida bread and from Leinster,

but she's if we go to the numbers she's on bidding in in

in the US she have she have won four or five, but the only time

that she didn't won was actually because she was at Roy, Alaska.

And she ran very well and. She ran very well.

So she's in the outside post with Louis Size who knows her.

Outside post again. There we go.

That's that's a big that's a big question mark the same.

You will need to go and go running, but you're going to

stay out of any issues when the people it breaks and try to get

close to the rail. Let's put that in perspective.

The other one, everybody's talking about him because he's

he looks honestly like a pro. He said nothing.

This is a horse that it shows you character.

It shows you that he knows what he's what he's doing.

I was like yesterday watching him.

You, you can all imagine the number of media outlets that are

here and he was surrounded, I would say like between 25 to 30

different media outlets with cameras pointing to him while he

was waiting to be bathed. He was who as a cucumber like

enjoying the look, posing for the people look like no issues

at all. He knows that he owns the place,

the same character, like a sovereignty of the same

character. Even firstness, like you see the

way how he acts. You know that this is a horse

that knows that he has the talent.

He have proof that he can run the 2 terms.

He have proof that he has the ability to to to get here.

Although this is a very heavy feel because we're talking about

the very talented brand with a big question.

Can he make it to the two turns at the distance?

There's opinions like one way or the other.

He had look at very well as well in the mornings.

And the other one is Intrepido, the winner of the American

Pharaoh. They are the owner are very

happy with the post position. I just spoke with with Doctor

Berrios. He's like, I know my horse can

go to the lead. I'm not going to give it a try.

I think I'm going to be more more easy at the beginning and

try to find my position. But this is a horse that

actually beat some of the so he has the talent so and the other,

if you want to add one more to the mix, it would be blackout

time. I have seen the horses early in

the morning like as Kenny Mcpeak does with with the big horses

that he has like that he take them for the track opens at

5:30. That horse is waiting at 5:25 to

be outside. Basically a blackout town has

been like that. He has been running.

He has shown a lot of strong will to run and that to me, it

tells me this horse is ready for bigger deals.

And I remembered Kenny Mcpeet's telling me if this horse proved

me when it was prior to the Brewers Futurity that he can go

to the distance and prove that he's in the top three, he will

be the best next thing for next year.

And we're talking about the person that prior to the

Kentucky Oaks last year, was saying exactly the same.

About who? Torpedo Anna.

So definitely this is something that we need to take into

consideration as well. Those are the horses in that

race that had caught my attention the most.

There's a plenty of talents out there of two years old.

You mentioned cucumbers. Cucumbers are trash but Pickles

are awesome. Yes.

OK, All right. I wanted to get that out for the

audience I wanted to make. Sure.

I also just wanted to say. Cool as a pickle.

Cool as a pickle. I actually.

I actually prefer Pickles. I don't like cucumber.

Thank. You, we're all on the same team

with that. Well, you mentioned Blackout

Town. There YouTube.

If you like me, the comparison of Torpedo Anna, Torpedo Anna

was the Grizzly. I guess Black Blackout Time has

to be a black bear then, right? It just goes with the name.

I like that. I think that.

I think that's what we have to go with.

I think the gear would be awesome too, right?

I think like the T-shirts. That would be amazing Black

bear. Let's go no.

And that designed even with the name of the horse black out

time. Kenny, Kenny, if you're

listening to this, we get 10% of all profits for coming up with

the idea. Carlos growl I got nothing for

you. This is what we bring you a

blood horse with the Breeders. This is what it is.

Oh man, you know, and it's it's such a it's such a fun day

Friday, right, because we do get to meet these horses many times

for most of us in the United States, seeing them in person

for the first time, certainly we've watched them, whether it's

at ask it or if it's at lawn Shawn, something like that.

Beginning to see them in person. What do you find yourself

rooting for more? And be honest with the nice

folks who watch Blood Horse here on YouTube or on Spotify.

Are you you're betting on your root for your bets.

Are you willing to like, you know what?

That was OK. That was a great performance

because I find myself doing that more at the Breeders Cup than

anywhere else, frankly. Yeah, in the Breeders Cup, your,

your focus, or at least my case and focus is just about that

show the performance, trying to like the horses that I like,

that they do their best and if they don't, that they arrive

safe for the for the for the race.

That's that's what I'm rooting for in the totality of the

different horses. All right, most likely to win on

Friday is. Tech Noffy.

OK, Tech Noffy, there you go. In the juvenile, of course.

They're in Race 9, penultimate part of the Breeders Cup card

here on Friday at Delmar. This is blood horse at the

Breeders Cup. Let's talk about those races

now. We'll be joined by our guy, our

editor on this podcast. We think he's probably the best

person who's ever lived. His name, of course, is Frank

Giggs. And as we.

Just like those jokes. I actually don't know.

I don't think that's why. Well, as we as we determined a

few episodes ago on Blood Horse Monday, he's one of the Blood

Horse worthy plushies. No doubt about.

We're gonna make. We're not about Frank Ink's

plushies, no doubt about it. If you don't know what we're

talking about, go back and. Go back to the K Hunter.

Yeah, two weeks ago or Blood Horse Monday that.

Means that you don't only talk about horses here, you also have

marketing ideas. An advertising idea?

Exactly. That's that's why, that's why

people watch for the marketing. I mean we.

Got how do we can get? We can get, yeah, we get the

plushies. Now I mean like these are

things. Yes, I think we need to get a

Carlos plushy. That's what I think.

You just OK, boy? Boy, You're putting Anne in

carton, Boy. Oh, I think he's at that level

already. Thank you.

Have you won two great ones. That's what we found out were

the requirements in Japan. Oh, really?

Yes, it's a tough country, I'll tell you.

I don't think, I don't think my because of my physique, I don't

think I'm gonna be able to run, but I'm gonna do my best.

Exactly. Yeah, I can definitely make that

grade too. Not, not two grade ones.

I can make it even 3-4. You tell me.

He's a He's a 1 furlong specialist exactly.

Half one for them, half one. For 3/4 of a furlong please in

42 a change, that's all. At least Carlos Morales if you

are. If you are Espanol Latte and you

are watching this episode, I cannot suggest enough.

I hate this presser Cinco go check them out.

Go see Carlos at a hint days 305 for sure on all of the socials

as well. One of the great the great cogs

in our in our national turf writers group as well.

I wanted to say thank you to that for sure.

Being on the board, they're doing that kind of volunteer

work so I don't have to. It's a really great thing you're

doing. I do it because precisely for

that reason, and I'm very happy that I'm taking that weight out

of your shoulders. I appreciate it very much.

And on top of all that, yes, he's the one who recommended me

the tripod that we're currently using to film this.

The D Wade Lucas Memorial Tripod.

Exactly they are. That's right.

We all go to this guy. Whenever we have some kind of

idea he's the guy, we go. To We'll have to tell that we'll

have to tell the Wade Lucas tripod story at some point.

That has to become part of the show, doesn't it?

Will. But not today, because we're

going to leave people in suspense because it's time to

talk to breeders. Cup.

It's called a tease, people. A tease.

Frank Angst. He's next all right here with

Frank Angst in the paddock here at Del Mar as part of our blood

horse at the Breeders Cup series.

We're going to talk turf racing on the the Friday card,

essentially for juveniles. A2 year olds here, if you're new

to the sport, this is the first year that horses race and this

is the championship for the best of the youngest horses here.

Frank, you're going to be doing a lot of work, a lot of write

ups on the Sprint which is going to kick off the Breeders Cup

races frankly for the whole weekend.

In Race 5 on Friday, what are some of the storylines you're

looking forward? To well first of all it's an

intriguing race and that it's Phillies and Colts.

The trainers are very willing to race Phillies against Colts as 2

year olds typically and I'm looking at it and most of the

top horses I'm seeing and a juvenile turf Sprint are

Phillies. George Weaver has a Philly named

Royal Testament who drew to post 3 and there's no speed inside

her. I believe she's going to go

right to the lead. She wired a field at Colonial,

which always catches my eye. It's a difficult place to go

gate to wire. She bobbled in the last start so

we we don't have to worry about that.

I think what she wants is the lead.

So I think she's a threat. Obviously the the most likely

winner that the class of the field is Aiden O'Brien's Philly

True Love is already won a group, one who's already

defeated males. So she's checked every box and

it's the class of the field and you certainly would be looking

for her. But you know, it's a bet.

I think the European horses usually come from behind and

Royal Testaments going to go to the lead.

So I always like when I'm handicapping it, find a horse

that does something different than the favorite.

Yeah, figured that's that's probably the best way to beat

them rather than trying to out close a closer or something like

that. So I think Royal Testament's

interesting. And actually George Weaver's

other horse on the outside, Cy Fair has has a closing kick too.

I don't know if it's going to work out compared to Aiden's or

so. Yeah, it's interesting.

What do you make of Lenalou who's coming out of the Florida

circuit? They tried to ask it with this

one, frankly showed well at ask it when she was over there out

of the BN phone barn, as I said. And she's one of those frankly,

that's been good since she's been back.

It's always tough to know though, with that really firm

turf at at at Gulfstream if it's going to translate here.

And those, you know, the the one thing I do think the two year

olds have a chance to develop early in Florida.

So that's nice. And and Lenalu did beat Royal

Testament first out before Royal Testament kind of hit some of

her better races. So definitely a threat for sure

on the outside. That's probably just enough the

speed to stay inside it to stay in it.

This course is is is strange in that the turf sprints a lot of

times come from behind and the route races seem to be more

toward the front end. So Royal Testament, you know,

it's not, she's not really running toward to the course,

but she's already shown she could do that at Colonial.

And you know, there's no exceptions to every rule.

And she's 12 to one morning. Line yeah, 12 to one in a turf

race at Breeders' Cup Friday seems like a great value.

It's certainly the kind of, frankly, This is why we come to

the Breeders Cup, the 12 to one value on a very good horse,

right? That that in the sea, the

superstars which we might have won in true love, and there's no

doubt about that. I wouldn't be shocked if a

Nobrien wins all three of these turf races.

The other races he has horses that are morning line under 2 to

1, so this is sort of the longest shot of the bunch, about

7:00 to 2:00 or something. But very capable of winning

here. I won't be surprised at all.

Yeah, it wouldn't be surprising at all.

All right, we're going to get Sean back in here for the dirt

racing portion of this. We'll talk juvenile Phillies

next. All right, thanks to Frank Eggs.

They're in Race 6. Go to Race 7 now here.

Juvenile Phillies go to the dirt here, of course.

Kentucky Oaks time already. There it is, of course, our guy.

What a job I have. All right, so.

You got to keep tempering my do. I need to even here.

We are here, we are in November and I'm already looking at May.

All right, so I, you and everyone else, I brought it up

to begin the show, so that's all right.

There are a lot of interesting runners in this race.

I think of the Friday races, I don't want to say that this is

the one that's most difficult to predict, but it might be the one

that doesn't have the Super high end top.

Yeah, superstar in the race, right?

It could that be this race. I I think so, because I feel

like a lot of years we come into the juvenile Phillies and we

might not, there are a lot of years where we do have kind of

that one stand out Philly as we come into it like we had with

immersive last year. Fair enough.

But there's also years where we've had multiple kind of like,

or these both could be really good Phillies or, you know,

these both look like stand out Phillies.

You think back to when it was Songbird versus Rachel

Valentina. Obviously Songbird ended up

going on to have the better career.

But going into that race, it was like, alright, these could be

two heavyweights going at each other.

These are two future stars. I don't know if we really have

that feeling this year that we have a future star in this

field. Obviously, somebody's going to

end up winning this race. I feel like especially when you

look at the Alcibiades, which recently has been a good

predictor for this race, I feel like it left more questions than

it answered anything coming into this and it just, it just seems

like it could be wide open there.

This could be a race where, you know, the favorite could end up

winning or we could see like a 20 to 1 upset, something like

that. Somebody end up getting.

This who are a couple that you're.

Watching that I'm watching I do I I did really like Percy's bars

run in the Alcibiades, even though she got disqualified.

I liked the how she ran in that race.

I thought it was just kind of happenstance that she kind of

took that sidestep. I agreed with the

disqualification, no doubt about it, but I don't think

necessarily that Tommy Joe was going to go by.

I agree and I like seeing and you know Tommy Joe had been so

impressive around one turn, but I felt like Percy's bar took it

up a notch going around those two the two turns for the first

time. If she can ship, if she can

translate that here, I think she's going to be very tough in

this spot. What do you think of Tommy Joe?

I don't know what to think about her coming out of that race.

Was it did she get when she got cut off?

Is that the reason why she ended up fading that last 16th?

Or was she hitting the wall a little?

Bit I'll say this, I think she was hitting the wall, but I

don't know if she would have would not have gone by.

I'll be. I want to be really clear

because. Maybe there's more questions

than answers. Well, and frankly, these are two

year olds. Yeah, that was her first try.

I'm trying two turns, so maybe she just needed the experience

of doing that. The distance here is different

than Keeneland. Yeah, the set up here is

different. As far as the stretch, I know we

talked about that short stretch of Keeneland, that mile on a

16th. Oh, it'll translate to Del Mar.

That doesn't always translate anything like that because

they're set. The course can, you know,

configurations are different. We just talked with Carlos about

how tight the turf course is, for example.

I think that Tommy Joe with the the experience last out

absolutely can win here. Do I expect her to?

I'm not sure, frankly. Who do you think's gonna be

favored in this race? Does Tommy Joe get it just

because of the the Pletcher connection and you know, did?

She second time routing. She was going into the

Alcibiades. That's kind of like the hot 2

year old Philly. Does that stick around?

But I read yeah, I believe. So, yeah, OK.

No, no. John Velazquez.

John Velazquez. Darn.

Yeah, right. OK.

Yeah, yeah, Yeah, I think she will be, actually.

Yeah. You think I'll go with that?

Unless one of the locals lands in that spot.

Can it be explorer Bob Baffert? You know he's going to take

money. Yeah, she's going to take money.

The oak leaf. When, Yeah.

And the oak leaf was impressive. She was.

It was. She was.

And so you know what? I'll go with that.

I'll go with Explorer just because.

Baffert, Delmar. You know, and the question marks

with Tommy Joe, I think too, just because of what happened at

the end of the last. Week I talked with with Matt

Bernier from NBC this morning on on ESPN Radio that we're doing

here live. You can listen 7:00 to 9:00 AM

Pacific Time 11:50 Eastern. And of course it is available on

podcast as well. But the he said the same thing

you did. Yeah, I'm unimpressed with the

Alcibidis. And so if that's the case, if

that's becoming a prevailing opinion, then yes, Explorer will

be the favorite. Yes, I think so.

And so and I think at morning line she was 5 to 2 on the

morning. Yeah, she was favorite on on the

morning line as well. So I would expect, especially

with the Baffert connection, you know how dominant he is when we

have the races here, the Breeders Cup here.

And so I think that's probably going to she's probably going to

end up taking a lot of money as well.

One of the long shots that I kind of like in here is Super

Corridor, who's coming out of her maiden victory for John

Sadler. She won that maiden race by 8

and 1/4 lengths. And actually while you and Frank

were filming the Juvenile Turf Sprint here just a few moments

ago when you guys were talking about that race, Terry Finley

actually walked past me, West Point thoroughbreds who own her

who co-owner. And I asked him what he thought

of his chances tomorrow with the horses that he has.

He spoke very highly of this Philly.

They think they think they're sitting on a pretty good one

right here. So I was already kind of liking

her coming into this race hearing that from them.

I think this Philly's maybe potentially getting her set up

for a big race and we talked about how there's not really

necessarily that stand out that we can see yet.

Why not? The horse that just broke her

maiden, took her three tries to break her maiden, but that was

her first time around. Two turns going the one mile

distance. And you know, she's developing

Philly. She's finally figuring it out.

Why not take another step forward against this field?

Wally on the outside is another interesting local.

I mean, frankly, if you wanted to try to try that there, you're

going to get the outside post. She's going to be able to make

her trip that way. I think she's massively

interesting and frankly, in a in a 2, 3 year old race where a lot

of them are figuring out two turns, yet still there might be

a little too much pace up front, La Wally can definitely close

into it. So I think there's a potential

that she's the one in the winner's circle at the end of

the Breeders Cup. Juvenile Phillies.

We'll bring Frank back in. We'll talk Juvenile Phillies

turf with him up next. All right, back with Frank eggs

here as we we look at the grass races, the turf races here on

Breeders' Cup Friday, the juvenile day.

Of course, juvenile Philly turf will break in race 8.

We get a potential superstar, but boy, she's going to have to

do a superstar effort from the outside of Frank imprecise.

She's going to break from the 13 here.

Now, let's be very clear. We've seen horses break from the

outside of these turf races at the Breeders Cup and win before.

But but but her route coming in here.

We saw Lake Victoria come over last year with a lot of hype,

went ahead and won this race as well.

She's won multiple group ones here.

The post is tough, but boy, she's a class here.

Yeah, you know, Aiden has always, Aiden O'Brien, a

trainer, has always brought top horses to Breeders' Cup.

But I really feel like in recent years he's brought 2 year olds

that are perhaps better than what he had previously been

bringing. And this horse hits the bone.

Who's won four in a row coming off back-to-back Group One.

Yeah, back-to-back Group One wins.

So definitely the class of the field, just his face, just some

of the top, you know, she's been facing a higher level class than

these others. But the outside post is not

ideal, there's no doubt about that.

Inside we'll see Queen of Hawaii a winning Group 3 company last

out what I wanted to ask you about there Frank isn't what do

you think of her chances here? I like that she has experience

going left-handed right. So one of the things I always

watch especially with younger turf horses coming out of Europe

is hey can you handle the bend. So many of them just run those

five furlongs straight at ask it or other places taking the left

hand. Do you do you care about that

experience with your? Handicap, I mean, I think having

that experience around a turn for sure.

I, I don't know if it matters a whole lot right-handed or

left-handed, but but better than a straight.

I, I would agree with that. And, and one thing that I will

say that happens year after year at the Breeders Cup.

And I'm not saying unload your wallet on this horse.

But what I'm, what I am saying is in general is American

handicappers, we're very, very good at picking out the top

European horse. But what will happen is you'll

find a European horse that lost to that horse by a length or

half length or has done some nice things on their own and

they go off at like 12:50. And I mean, I, I know you can

only bet so many horses, but I do find a trend sometimes that

we focus so much on one European horse and they get driven down

in odds. But you'll have another horse

that's really kind of right there and go off at very

generous odds, and that could be the case here.

We're seeing a bunch of horses this year who have run on good

to firm go in Europe as well. It's been a dry autumn over

there, both in France and in the British Isles.

And so a horse like Pacific Mission, who's going to break

from the 12 here, Frank is going to have that kind of experience

as well. I think the surface almost

matters more than the turn experience, frankly, because if

you're, if you're a good yielding horse or a good soft

horse, that's not what we do in North America usually, right?

And so I think those kinds of horses coming over with more of

that experience might even elevate the EUR a little.

More for sure and I think a lot of the European based trainers

have become have gotten very good at that.

They know the types of horses that are going to like this type

of surface and that could very well fit the bill with that one.

You know, for for the US horses I've got my eye on Ultimate Love

has improved every start. It's Johnny Velasquez, which

anyone that's been paying attention for the racing for

about the last month, he is on fire.

As good as John is, John has been throughout his entire

career. He is right there riding like

that right now. You need a little bit of that

when you break from the rail as this horse will have to, but I

think Johnny's going to have her well placed and if she improves

again she she could pull it off. You know, I, I was reminded

today watching the races here on, on a Thursday at Del Mar,

that that the start of the mile on the turf course here does

actually give you a little time before the first turn to, to at

least get into position. You're going to have to do some

work. Look on that first turn for

sure, but breaking from the rail, not necessarily a, you

know, a toss automatically. For sure.

Yeah, it looks like the horse is comfortable.

And it's not one to, like necessarily rush up.

That's sometimes horses get on the rail and they feel like they

have to immediately compete and sometimes they sort of do the

whole position. But this one looks like she'll

be comfortable. So I think she should be all

right on the rail. British Cup Juvenile in a race

and I will bring Sean back in for that one.

All right, Shawn Collins back in with me here in the paddock at

Del Mar. We're going to be talking

Breeders' Cup Juvenile, essentially the.

This this isn't Kentucky Derby talk.

All right, I'll, I'll see you later.

All right, so that was Shawn Collins.

The purple lights behind us indicate Breeders' Cup.

And so yes, we are in the paddock at Del Mar ahead of the

Friday card. Those juveniles going to make

their way to the track. Race 9 is the juvenile itself.

In this race we get the match up on the outside of the two horses

from the other sides of the Rockies, right?

Of course, the local $3,000,000 purchase in Brant out of the

Baffert barn. The winner of the Del Mar

Futurity here right behind us, frankly.

And then you get Ted Noffy. The awesome story, of course.

The playfully named after Ned Toffy, the.

Thanks to us. At Blood Horse.

You can hear that story on the Blood Horse Monday podcast from

a few weeks. Ago Sean's tweet.

It was not. I had nothing to do with that.

Tweet, not Sean's tweet, even though I really wish it were,

and I think Sean probably wishes it was at this point too.

If I could, if yeah, if I could say that I caused a Grade 1

winner's name, I would. Actually, I would, I would own

that as well. But but those two are going to

break from the outside. Many people expecting it to be

those two that do most of the work and one of them end up in

the winner's circle. Are you of that opinion?

Yes, I am. I think that these two really

are at this point, the standouts.

The main difference between them is just that Ted Nafi has run

the mile on the 16th already versus Brant has not gone around

two turns. So that's the main difference

between them. If Brant can take that step

forward around two turns, wouldn't be shocked at all to

see him win this race. But it just seems like coming

into it that these two are maybe just a step above the rest of

the division at this point. Ted Nafi kind of easily handled

some of the some of those top 2 year olds over on the East Coast

and then in in Kentucky as well. And so if he can then travel out

here and do the same thing, I think we got a real superstar in

our hands. We heard Carlos Morales earlier

in the show talking about how confident that he is in that

horse. I just really liked in the

Breeders Futurity we mentioned earlier with the Alcibiades how

we had so many questions with it.

But in the Breeders Futurity, we saw a horse that looked like an

old veteran. He was doing the the two turns

for the first time, didn't look like it phased him one bit.

And so that gives me a lot of confidence that as long as he

can handle the ship and he can handle the travel, which

recently when we've had this big horse coming out of Kentucky to

the races over here on the East Coast, whether it be Dennis's

moment, whether it be E Avenue last year, we haven't seen.

Yeah, we haven't seen. Now of course they stumbled out

of the game. Hopefully it's had.

But they also, I think both of them had the rail too.

So Technophe at least avoided that.

But but we have been down this path before where we have that a

horse coming in from Kentucky, from the East Coast that we

think looks unbeatable. And then something weird happens

like that and they're just never the same horse again.

So maybe it happens here, maybe we see an upset, but it sure

seems like Ted Nafi's kind of a step above.

There are two of them coming out of other races, excuse me, one

of them out of Kentucky, one of them out here on the West Coast

that are going to be higher are odds horses.

We'll start with the Kentucky based horse.

You heard Carlos talk earlier about Kenny Mcpeak and how he's

talking about blackout time at this point and what they are

expecting from him in the spring.

Kenny's a pretty transparent guy.

Is he telling us that maybe he's not going to win today, but boy,

watch for him at Oak Lawn or something like that?

Is there a potential that he's saying that?

I think, I think so. I think he's definitely saying

that because he he's been really confident on this horse.

If you turned into tuned into Blood Horse Monday back before

the Breeders Futurity, he mentioned that at this point in

his career, Blackout Time is kind of way ahead of where

Mystic Dan was as far as development.

We all know what Mystic Dan went on to do, and when I spoke to

him at Churchill last week after Blackout Time recorded his final

breeze for this race, he was talking about like, you know,

we, we know that Ted Nafi was better than us on that day,

right? But you know, it is, it's worth

racing. Anything can happen.

We're going to. Horses turn the tables all the

time. We're going to hope that a month

later we're better because we have the confidence that you

know, Kenny was mentioning when I talked to him a week ago.

This isn't just about winning the Breeders cup juvenile.

They think they have a real shot to win the eclipse award for

champion 2 year old. That's why they're out here.

That's how much they think of this horse.

The fact that they think that he's championship quality.

So and it seems like they're only expecting him to get better

as the months go on. So even if, if he doesn't get

Ted Noffy's number this weekend today, then they're still,

they're still looking at the springtime as one to watch.

I don't know if he's at the point yet where he can get Ted

Noffy, where he can get Brandt today, but maybe down the line

he can. But of course, today we're

worried about today. Intrepido's going to break from

the rail. Yes.

Is no one talking about this horse?

Is this the complete, like, why are we not talking about Horse

of the weekend? I, I, I, you know, I was, I was

talking with another handicapper a couple of days ago and he

said, hey, give me a long shot in the juvenile.

Give me, you know, we got these two favorites at the top.

Who's the guy that can hit the board?

And I'm like, I don't think of him as a long shot, but the,

what are the American Pharaohs in here?

Yeah, a great 1-2 turns, all the things and trepidos in here.

Keeps the keeps the jock all the things.

Yeah, I think he's at least at least in everybody's trifecta.

And goodness gracious, I I'll be honest, I would not be surprised

if you won no at all it. Wouldn't be that surprising And

I mean his he's 2 for two around two turns.

So maybe he's just one of those horses that's, you know, like

liking that extra stretch out in distance.

He seems to be underestimated. It seems like that he is flying

under the radar. I look at this, you know, when

you look at these two year old races, a lot of times we see

year after year where it's the Bafferts dominating.

They win, they run first and second, first, second, third in

these races. We saw last year with journalism

in the low S Futurity when another trainer has a horse that

can handle the Bafferts and beat them as a 2 year old, that's a

pretty nice horse. Yeah.

All right, good point. And so the fact that he was

able, the fact that he was able to go up against the Bafferts in

the American Pharaoh, take them down in that race already

heading into the Breeders Cup, who knows how good this horse

can be? Cuz it seems like whenever we do

see that happen, it seems like we have a pretty strong talent

on our hands. It's almost like we can use the

Bafferts getting beat as a judge as a gauge for how good the

other horses, the other horses in that division are out here in

California. Are you saying Baffert ducked

Intrepido by running Brant in the Delmar Futurity instead?

I wouldn't go that. Far.

I think that's what you just said to our lovely audience here

on Blood Horse. We'll, we'll see.

I don't. Know if I would go that far?

I wouldn't. Either I believe Sean Collins,

we appreciate him hanging out on this episode.

You'll see Sean again, of course, on our Saturday episode,

Blood Horse at the Breeders Cup here.

We'll get Frank back in here, talk the closer, which is, of

course, the Juvenile Turf. Race 10 on Friday will be the

Breeders Cup Juvenile Turf, a race that I always look forward

to. Frank, I love that they close

the card with this race. It always seems to have a ton of

quality in it and we got quality again this year.

His name is Gustad. And guess what?

Frank, just like Precise, will be on the very outside of the

starting gate for this one, breaking from the 14.

And you mentioned something earlier that I think applies to

him, except that I expect him to be the favorite.

Here is a bit of seconditis. He's run third in his last or

second in his last three races and so he'll have to get over

that second Itis to win a Breeders' Cup race here.

I do think he's the most talented in this field, but as

you talk about, hey, don't look past those, those European

horses that have been, you know, second by 1/2 a length or

something like that. He kind of fits the bill here.

Yeah, and that's really good advice when you have a bigger

price, but this this one will be a smaller price.

Whereas precise the Philly had come in on a win streak and some

of the top races for two year olds in Europe, Gustad has been

right there for some of the top races for two year old males in

Europe and open races, but hasn't quite always got there.

It's probably safe to say that the competition over there was

better, so we'll see how it sets up here.

I I do think there's enough speed for for him to set up his

run, but again, Charles, the outside that difficult.

They're going to have to navigate their way and make that

work. Yeah, we were talking during the

Juvenile Phillies turf about that little bit of a run up

before the turn there, so hopefully he'll be able to get

into that. I know you're looking at Bodice

as well out of the Clemont barn, A horse that you like because of

the late kick. Yeah, I mean, I do think there's

enough speed in here to set up a late kick.

Most likely biggest thought, but Bodice is a horse that also

possesses a late kick, seems to be improving, has a patient

jockey and Manny Franco. I guess the question with him is

the short stretch. Here it is, especially on the

turf course. When you see it in person, it's

kind of like couldn't have gone another 16th a mile.

But it is what it is. That's what we're here at Delmar

and that's the course they're all going to race on.

You're just going to have to start that move a little bit

early, but does have the kick qualifies on that.

One of the more remarkable stories of the year is how

Miguel has has moved in to the lead spot in the Clemont

operation and they have not missed a beat.

And frankly, they're having one of the best years that I can

remember with their operation. Just an incredible job by.

Him, yeah, just an amazingly smooth takeover and just haven't

missed a stride. And I've just continued the

quality that we've seen in that stable with his father.

Another one that should be closer to the pace but is a

European runner is Argos coming into his coming into their own

break in from the 9 here. And what do you make of Argos

here and actually an American based?

Runner yeah, yeah. So Riley Mott, the son of Bill

Mott, is looking for his first Breeders' Cup win.

They've been racing this horse up at Woodbine, which is more of

a European style course, but actually it was the inner turf I

believe. So it's a little bit different.

They're doing some remodeling that would.

But it is 2 turns like we're. Gonna have here I had to kind of

remind myself of that. It's a little bit different

course, but that the horse seems to be on the improve.

It's improved it's speed figures every race.

So if it does that again, I think it's right there and

you're looking at good horse. Yeah, we're seeing Riley Mott,

of course. We'll see.

We'll Walden and we'll see Miguel Clemont, the three

buddies from their childhood, all with Breeders' Cup starters

this year. Remarkable story for sure.

Well, Frank, thanks a lot. Where can people find all of

your write ups about it? So bloodhorse.com is just jam

packed with stories this week. Just really incredible job on

the entire staff. Terrific videos.

Of course, the Beach Monday podcasts.

Then for those that don't subscribe, we have a free

newsletter. VH Daily.

And the nice thing about it is you can just sit down at one

time and kind of go through it all if you don't want to keep

like going back and seeing what what we posted again.

So you can do it either way. Just constantly check your phone

or you can go and get it all at once.

Usually comes out around 9:00 or 10:00 PM Eastern Time.

Blood horse app always a good idea and of course,

bloodhorse.com. Check out the daily.

There's also just a Breeders' Cup tab at the top of the

homepage. You are certainly welcome to

peruse that. Well, he's Frank Angst.

I'm Lou Rebo. Thanks to Sean Collins and

Carlos Morales for joining us on this rendition of Blood Horse at

the Breeders Cup. We'll be back for a championship

edition. The classic awaits on Saturday.

We'll see you tomorrow. The Blood Horse is dedicated to

the improvement of thoroughbred breeding and racing over 100

years. Don't forget to like, subscribe

and save Blood Horse Monday on all your platform.

For the latest news, analysis and insight, visit us at

bloodhorse.com. Thanks for listening and we'll

see you next week.