BloodHorse Monday 5/26/25 | Robert Clay/Baeza

All right, well commanded is a Memorial Day edition of blood

horse Monday. He's Sean I'm Louis.

Thanks so much for joining us again this week here on blood

HORSE Monday, the podcast that gets your horse racing week

going. You understand me.

This is how you start every single Monday when we.

Spend our holidays now. Well, apparently, yeah, right.

I would say it's a it's a legitimate question about how

Sean has chosen to start your young adult life and you're

choosing to start your weeks with me.

It is troubling. I'm with you.

Yeah. I know if if this if spending my

holidays with you is where I've come to in this sport.

I must be on the downward. Slope, it is the, it is the, you

know, you're like 6-7 years old. They're deciding what your

future plans are going to be, that kind of thing in horse

racing. Doesn't look like I'm going to

have much of A stallion career. That's right, give me a jump

horse suit. But no, the this is an

interesting time in the horse racing calendar where we're a

week out, you know, 9:00-ish days from the Preakness.

It it almost feels like there's such a rush to get to Baltimore

after the Derby. Yeah, there's such intensity in

those two weeks that almost the three weeks which we would think

of as a quick turn around in general terms for the Belmont,

feels like we're slowing down. Right, exactly.

If you had time to reflect on things, we've seen some of the

comments come out. Obviously the Maryland Stewart's

making no change in the Preakness any any changes in

Sean's thoughts about what was an unbelievable.

Preakness no, I still think that performance by journalism was

just incredible. The fact that he overcame

everything. It's been interesting to see,

You know, when we talked about it last week, it was obviously

just two days right after the race.

We've seen a lot more reaction from different people since

mainly, I think from Steve Asmussen on the Steve Pick Show

about his thoughts on, you know, the Stewart should have.

Done by the way, very appreciative of him being as

honest as he was. Our sport means as much of that

kind of conversation as it can get.

Exactly. Yeah, it's clever.

Again, we got the worst that's found on the inside.

But I still think, I still think making no change was the right

move. Maybe they should have done

something as far as a fine or something with the jockeys

afterwards for for the riding. But I still think as far as the

race scenario, I think that was the right one.

That's a. Tough job and not one that I am

very well cooked to do, but that's.

Why we stay here and review it and not the ones that's?

Why we're in a studio that's exactly right.

But Robert Clay is going to join us now here from Grandview, and

I am excited to have him in because he is involved in a

horse named by Aza, who ran in one of those races with the

aforementioned journalism, the Kentucky freaking Derby.

How about that? A couple of those things.

That's right, I had Santa Derby. That's exactly right.

Well, Robert, happy Memorial Day.

I appreciate you jumping on a little early.

We almost interrupted your golf game, which we don't want to do

on this show. Well, thank you for having me

earlier. It's no problem at all.

How was your spring been going? What is the whirlwind been like

since, you know, that decision to run in the Santa Anita Derby

and then of course making making your way to Louisville for the

Kentucky Derby 151? Well, it's been an exciting

spring. I mean, the, the Derby week was,

was almost surreal. We, we, we spent so much time

worrying about getting in the race that by the time the race

came around, we weren't nervous at all.

We, we spent all our nerves. But it's, it's been an exciting

time. I think we knew we had a nice

horse and and he's sort of proven that he belongs in this

group and and we're looking forward to the Belmont.

Obviously he has the pedigree, which we'll talk about in a

little bit to match up with these top horses.

But, you know, he was not, he's not a stakes winner yet.

He was coming off a maiden win when you ran him in the Santa

Anita Derby, yet he ran such a strong third.

Maybe he would have ran a little bit better if he didn't get

stuck in some traffic there. Maybe he could have gotten up

for at least a second. But a lot of people come out of

the Derby looking at him as one of the top three horses in this

division. And that says a lot for a horse

that hasn't, you know, got that stakes win yet, right?

That's, that's right. I mean, he's, he was, he was

green in the, in the center Anita Derby.

You know, it was first time Pratt was on him in the Derby

and that's, that's a tough race. He he was finishing strong and I

I think he just gets better with every race.

He's training well. I think we're looking forward to

an exciting year with him. Talking with Robert Clay, part

of the ownership of Baeza, when you hear that Flavia Pratt is

going to be aboard there for the Kentucky Derby, what goes

through your mind? Because I'll be honest, I threw

him into a bunch of wagers based on Flavia telling me I'm going

to ride this horse. I think he was he, he really

wanted wanted to to ride this horse.

I think he was as nervous as we were, as we didn't know, he

didn't know what horse he was going to ride until Thursday was

a little bit crazy, but I think he, he wanted on him.

We wanted him. He's going to ride him again.

I, I, you know, walking back through the tunnel, I, I, I feel

like he said I may be waited a little long to push the button.

He had a lot of horse under him. Well, he's got a chance to push

the button a little bit earlier here coming up in the Belmont

Stakes. Just how's he been doing since

the Kentucky Derby? He's gone back to California to

train with John Sheriffs. Just how's he coming into the

Belmont? Really, well he had, he had a

really good gallop a week ago and then he had his, had his

work on on Saturday, a really strong work.

He'll ship in on Thursday and work next Sunday.

So I, I think everything's going.

I think John's happy. Robert Clay with us here on

Blood Horse Monday, take us through you.

You, you mentioned a couple of times waiting to get into that

Derby field. And it's one of those things,

Robert, that I, I know we're not supposed to do it, but I know

we're all convinced when the draw happens, those are the 20

horses we're going to get. And invariably, unfortunately,

usually somewhat, you know, spikes a fever or something like

that happens and we lose one of those starters in the gate.

But walk us through your thought process night after night.

But there's just no defections early in the week.

How are you starting to feel as we get to, I don't know, Tuesday

or so? Well, we thought, you know, we

were thinking this the same way early, you know, seven days out,

usually something happens. But every day we, we sat, John

and I sat in the chair in the shed row and nothing happened.

And so we, we started to get a little nervous.

But then at the end, you know, there were two that went out, as

you say, and inevitably or it, it, it usually happens that way.

But it was, it was a very strong security and vetting process

that was taking place. And so it didn't surprise us

completely that we, that we got in.

But we we have to admit, we were pretty nervous.

Well, Grandview Equine not only Co owners of Baeza, but you're

also the breeder of Baeza as well.

Obviously this states to Puka the fantastic mayor she

produced, Mage the Kentucky Derby winner, Door Knock the

Belmont winner, and Baeza third in the Derby now.

At the hassle like you didn't win the.

Hassle, but a lot, a lot of success on these last three kids

here, all the all bred by Grandview.

Take us back to that 2018 Phasic Tipton sale.

When you were looking at Puka, what was it about her that drew

you to her and thought that you wanted to take a chance with

her? Well, it really started when we

we bought 3 shares in in good Magic and we we wanted to

support him And so we went to the market to to buy buy a

couple of mares for him and I wanted to, to try to find a

Marin fold a gun runner. You know, he was just going to

stud. I was a big believer in him and

Alex Solis and Jason Litt help me and Alex was living in

California at the time and he'd watch that Finnegan's wait go

that powers coat Colts and the, you know, cooker herself was in

in the Breeders Cup juvenile. She was talented.

She was a lovely mayor. We put her on our list and and

we got we got lucky and bought her.

Of course, we had no idea that this this was going to happen,

but we, we had that gun runner foal and then we bred her to

good, good magic and good magic. And and then finally Mackenzie,

because we bought a share of Mackenzie.

So it's just she's, she's the one that made made the news.

But you mentioned, you know, having those shares in Good

Magic, the sire of both Mage and Door Knock.

What was it about him that you thought would be successful as a

stallion? Well, I mean, he, he, I was

sitting next to, to Barbara when, when he won the the

juvenile and, and Delmar and you know, he, he had, he had, he had

all the ingredients really. He had the pedigree and he and

he had to turn a foot from just a nice horse to take a shot on.

You got Baeza then for the Belmont, a McKenzie colt, as you

mentioned in this spot. Is there is there a desire on

your end Then just to have you know, is it a, is it a that's

the best way to put this. I don't want to say an insurance

policy, but just a diversity of options.

Then to have multiple sires with the same broodmare.

That way moving to McKenzie away from good magic.

Well, you mean breeding them consecutively or?

Yeah. Yeah, exactly.

Yep. You know, I think you, you can't

breed a mare to the same stadium, you know, for five or

six years in a row. You've got, you've got to

diversify a little bit And, and we, we had an investment in

McKenzie and so we just mixed, we mixed it up.

And so the Mackenzie's we've seen, we've seen some good

results for sure. Obviously the good magic

Speaking of themselves at this point, getting to that mile and

a quarter of Belmont, you got to feel real confident going into

that race. You know, I think I think by as

you'll he'll go all day long distance is not going to be his

issue. John's got him very fit.

He, you know, he gallops in 2 miles and he's, he's, he's a

really, really strong, beautiful colt and I don't think distance

will be his problem. The two weeks after the Derby

that I described earlier that that frantic time, was there a

moment in the bias of camp where you thought about shipping to

Baltimore? Or was the plan always, hey, if

we don't get it done in the Kentucky Derby for whatever

reason, we'll give the horse more of a quote, UN quote,

normal 2025 kind of schedule where he's going to go to the

Belmont instead? We, we never, never, never

crossed our minds really once he had not won the Derby.

You know, I, I went back to the to the barn and John said, you

know, we're shipping, we're shipping back to California.

And I think it was just too obvious of choice.

Well, take us back to 2023 when Mage is running down the stretch

for the Kentucky Derby. You know, we a lot of times we

hear the story of the ownership cheering for the horses.

They're coming down the stretch. You are not part of his

ownership. But as the breeder, what is that

experience like watching a horse that you bred win the Kentucky

Derby? Well, you know, it's sort of a

dream of a lifetime. And in that case, our

expectations were low. And when, when, when he started

making a move, we were, we were I, I lost my voice for a couple

of days after that. It's, it's, it's, it's just

another surreal moment. So you know, you, you just, I

hope that happens in your lifetime.

So it was a it was a big deal. Now take us into the business

side of this a little bit when it comes to puka.

So Mage ends up winning the Kentucky Derby.

Then during the summer, you have her next son, Dornock, starting

to, you know, run well in the maiden races.

He ends up going on to win the Remsen Stakes.

You make the choice to put her into the sale that year.

Obviously Dornock ends up winning the Belmont after that,

but in your mind as the breeder, what is the importance of

getting her in the sale right after the Derby win?

You might be, I don't know if you'd be kicking yourself now,

if you're like, oh, I should have waited for a door knock

too. That's why I told her.

But just so you know that immediacy of you win the

Kentucky Derby, we should look at what we can get for this

mayor. Well, you, you hit it on the

head. I'm kick.

I've been kicking myself ever since.

You know, we're, we're, we're in the commercial business and we

felt the time was right. We were hopeful to get a partner

and we came very close to getting a partner in that sale,

which would have, would have worked out better.

But you know, our experience over the years is, is a mayor

throws a couple of stakes winners and then she doesn't

throw many more. But these Blue Hen mayors, like

she has become, you know, they're, they're very, very

rare. And so we put, we put a price on

her and, and we were happy to take her back and we did take

her back. But before the sale was over

that evening, Jon Stewart went down to see her and, and made us

an offer. We, we, we had a Philly.

And and so, you know, we we were going to carry on the line with

the ownership of her Philly. Now, so you're not part of the

ownership with major door knock, you are with by ASA.

After seeing their success, what was it that made you want to

stay in with him? And when CRK stables Lee Searing

when he comes in, just how did that relationship come to be

where you're able to stay in on by ASA?

Well, we, we, we, we had by ASA in the sale.

He he brought a good price. He was a lovely horse and really

right after the hammer fell, I said to Alex, you know, let

let's see if we can buy a quarter of that back or if

they'll let us stay in for 1/4. So we went over and, and Dottie

and, and Gordo had was doing the bidding and we said, can you

know, can we keep 1/4? And, and, and she said, she

didn't say immediately, but she said let me check and, and they

said yes. So we we were fortunate to be

able to to be there the partner and we've gotten to know the

Syrians and rest is sort of history.

Robert play with us. Grandview I, I, I have to ask

you something because it's, it's something that seems to happen

on this show that I wasn't ready for when we started this thing

with owners, especially how personally you talk about these

horses, when you talk about Puka and who she is and, and what

she's meant to, you know, your operation to your life, frankly,

does that ever catch you off guard how much you fall in love

with these animals? Well, it doesn't catch you off

guard, but you but you do. I mean, especially if you've

bred one that goes on to be to be good and and and and

Philly's, you know, Philly's going to come home.

You're going to breed out of them.

And so you do, you should you do sort of become attached to those

Phillies and their daughters and those families and it's, you

know, you, you become attached to the, the family as much as

anything. Yeah, that's awesome.

Well, Robert, we really appreciate you taking some time

on the Memorial Day. What's our plan for the course

today? Are we trying to break 8090?

Is there a number that we're shooting for today when we get

out to the golf course? I'm just trying to win that $5

back that I lost yesterday. Ball bats, man.

I'll tell you what, it's it gets brutal out there $5.

Well, safe travels to Saratoga. We obviously safe travels by his

and everything else. Best of luck and safe trip in

the double. Thanks to you both all.

Right, Thank you, Robert. There you go Robert play joining

us here on Blood Horse Monday. I've always wanted to ask

someone about that sort of relationship and I appreciate

him going delving even further, which is it's not just that the

the mayor's come back their daughters and you know, and that

can continue so on. I remember interviewing Wayne

Catalano of all things after his he was 2500 or 3000 wins last

summer in Ellis. And I'm I'm very apologize

because he's exceptional. He's a great interview too.

And and I asked him about training kids of horses that he

had a trained before and do you see the traits?

And he said, yeah, you do. And once in a while it's not

good traits, but you do you get to know them as far as their

personalities and those different things.

And it's fun to hear, you know, from a guy like Robert about.

Yeah, you know, she, you know, not necessarily, you know, not

caught off guard by being in love.

But you know, you just, you just do, you get used to them and

then their personalities, that kind of stuff.

Yeah. And they become members of the

family when you especially when you have those multiple

generations, I mean we've seen some of these bigger breeding

operations that have, you know, kind of these long running

families. And he he talked about the

importance of the fact that even though they sold puka, they're

keeping her daughter. And so that way they can kind of

keep that, keep the family within their own family and keep

breeding from that. And, and, you know, just that

really a lot of times we don't talk about the, the, the

broodmare side of it as. Much.

You're right, but just the lasting impact that some of

these families have, I mean, you've seen places like Juddmont

and Godolphin kind of master that over the years.

And a lot of times these great horses, we always talk about the

stallions. We always get the stallions all

the love, but it's the broodmare families, the long running ones,

that really play a huge role. In all of this, yeah, I want to

thank Robert for stopping by. He was presented here on Blood

Horse Monday by FanDuel Racing. Download the app now.

I bet not with FanDuel Racing. Just those stories are so, so

fascinating. As we look forward now to a

Belmont Stakes, that is. It's interesting to watch these,

Sean, because the the Saratoga thing makes it different.

The obviously this year's sovereignty going straight to it

makes it extraordinarily different.

I was wondering with you this week, is this the second best

option we could get to a Triple Crown?

Runner is a rematch of the top two in the Derby, plus the horse

that filled out the trifecta. And one of those horses went on

to Baltimore to win the Preakness, and now we get all

three of those horses in New York.

Yes, that's OK for a horse skipping the Preakness, this is.

The a solid consolation. Yeah, this is the.

This is the best. Consolation we could get.

You have, you know, it's kind of like that dramatic journalism

went to the Preakness and won while sovereignty sat out.

What's gonna happen now with the journalism's doing the three

races in five weeks? Sovereignty's coming in on the

five weeks rest. It almost feels like it's that

kind of butting aheads of the thing that we were all debating

for the rest, you know, 3 weeks, you know, whether the Preakness

should be moved or not. Will journalism end up winning

and proving that that the races shouldn't move?

Will sovereignty, you end up winning and show that maybe the

races should move, But then when you throw by ASA in on top of

that and you have the top three finishers of the Kentucky Derby

coming back in this spot by ASA is a horse that we've all kind

of marked down in the winter as he's developing.

Will he end up making it to the Derby?

He makes it to the Derby. He runs well in the Derby.

He you know, maybe maybe if he got a little bit of a cleaner

trip, he ends up being even closer to journalism, maybe even

closer to sovereignty at the end of it.

So you have that part of it as well.

So it's going to be probably a small field, but when you're

looking at it, the talent level in this field is going to make

up for the short numbers and it's going to be 11.

Great race. We so something I think we we

have to, you know, balance of these conversations is quality

and quantity. You brought it up.

This could be a quality race, right?

We're going to get some other quality races coming up here as

well. We saw some of the names

mentioned for the Matt Wynn, for example.

Yeah, at Churchill Downs. And I don't want to skip past

the Belmont. That's not what I'm doing on

this show, I promise. But we're seeing a boy and we

were having this conversation the other day.

How the all of the three-year olds, the river, if there's a

river of horse racing, it leads straight to Louisville for the

Derby. And then once we get to

Churchill Downs, it kind of breaks into 5610 different

rivers of paths that horses could follow.

One of those is going turf racing again.

One of those is sprinting again. One of those is, you know,

trying to Matt win or trying to Belmont or running in the

Preakness. They're all very different

things. And I think it's been a very

good development this year that we're having conversations about

all of those paths. And frankly, sovereignty kind of

forced that on us. Yeah.

And I get, I get people being upset about sovereignty not

going. I, I was at was at a Memorial

Day Eve party in our neighborhood last night and I

got asked about it. It wasn't about journalism

running and running over a week after the race, over a week

after, hey, why didn't he go to the Preakness?

Not who won, not oh, wow, what a stretch run.

No, why didn't he go? And so I get it.

That's the storyline. But what's happened is because

of those conversations, I've gotten to say XYZ, here's what

Godolphin wants to do. Here's what you know, Bill Mott

likes to do. Here's, you know, sovereignty as

a horse doing this, blah, blah, blah.

It's been hopefully something we can build on, move forward from

because it shows the diversity of our sport so often.

We're we're a Derby sport. And you and I love the Derby.

There's nothing wrong with loving the Derby for sure, but

we don't have to just be a Derby sport, even just with three-year

olds. Yeah, we we want to spread love

to all the divisions here. And that's one of the unique

things about the Derby is it is kind of that meeting place of

forces that are going to break away into a bunch of different

divisions. You have the milers, you have

the sprinters, you have the turf forces who all aimed at the

Derby because it's the Derby. And it's almost like once they

run in the Derby, it's like their their status level

increases a little bit to where you start paying attention to

what they do the entirety of the rest of their careers where

maybe you wouldn't have otherwise.

And so it does bring some added attention to those Sprint races

you see every year where usually maybe one or two of those horses

come back in a race like the Woody Stevens on Belmont Stakes

day. And so that's keeping you paying

attention to the sprinting division.

This year you're going to have Flying Mohawk pointing towards

that Triple Turf Series out out in New York with the Belmont

Derby on his radar. So it's going to have you paying

attention to that three-year old turf division.

As these horses get older, you look at a horse like endlessly

last year who we're all looking to see if he can we now get back

to where he was before the Derby in that older turf division.

So you're paying attention to these other divisions kind of

for people who maybe don't follow the sport full time like

we do. Those Derby horses are one of

the are the ones where you can kind of latch on and see where

they go afterwards and kind of keep you focused on everything

else that's going on. We saw domestic product win a

Grade 1 going 7 furlongs last year also.

I mean, you get those horses sometimes the you know, I used

to host with a guy named Mike Gandolfo and a mutual friend of

ours and he used to say the Derby is the showcase for the

best 8th grade basketball players.

I like that, yes. And then?

By the time you get to the fall, they're expected to be kind of

in high school and then when they're 4-4 years old, they're

essentially college athletes. And then when they get to 5,

they're pros, right? And I think that's a real thing.

And I remember we don't since I've gotten to be around horse

racing and it's not a very long time, less than 20 years.

It is a reminder that I've gotten to see so few of those

horses come along. Gun Runner really stands out as

a horse that we got to watch grow up and get big and get the

powerful and really, really dominate those races when he was

five years old and running in those spots get out of the way

and he was he was a machine at that point.

And it's just a reminder that as we go through the three-year old

season every year, that give these guys some time, figure it

out, you know, because you might be a setter when you're in 8th

grade because you're tall, but you've got to be a couple point

guard at some point if you're never going to grow again these

guys. So yeah.

That's why it's so exciting to see, you know, the horses that

came back in the four year old division this year.

You look at fierceness setting a track record when winning.

Yeah, we see. That's a great off the bench.

That's exactly right. It's it's nice to see great

horses continue racing and continue to kind of show, show

off what what they can develop into.

And I mean, we have big races coming up this weekend.

We have Derby winner Dan running in the blame at Churchill coming

up this weekend. Host timing that the British

couple alone. Yeah.

And you're looking at Sierra Leone coming back for the

Stephen Foster at the end of at the end of the Churchill down to

meet here next month. And so really.

Good. That race, yeah, he's gonna like

be back at Churchill a lot I'm. Excited for that one for sure.

But then you look at that and then you also have the

sovereignty, the journalism, the Baeza.

You have these three-year olds where you're already kind of

looking at it like these are going to be big players when we

get to the Classic at the end of the year and when you have the

extraction. Pennsylvania, Derby and the

Haskell everything, actually. Yeah.

Well, when you have the expectation of we have a really

good crop of three-year olds and we have a really, really good

crop of older horses. We haven't even mentioned what

are you right but. Skippy runs today in the.

Yeah, in the Hollywood. But.

When you already have, when it's the end of May and you already

have this excitement for the Breeders Cup in November, of the

meeting of the three-year olds, of the older horses and the kind

of race that that's going to put up.

That's what's good for racing is the fact that we can already

look at, we want to follow every single step that these horses

will take between now and then and see where we end up on that

first Saturday in November. Hopefully everybody makes it

there. We can have one, one fantastic

race. But that's part of what makes

the summer so exciting after the Triple Crown is we have a solid

set of three-year olds, a solid set of older horses and we can't

wait to see the match up down the line.

The the three-year old sets especially interesting that you

just brought up because there are those at the very what we

consider to be in that top top tier, the three top finishers in

the Derby. I think it is the good thing

about the Derby is that actually those we consider to be that

they got. Well, when I talked to Mark

Cassie ahead of the Preakness, when he was going to run Sandman

in the Preakness Stakes, he said that, you know, looking at the

division, he felt like there was a clear top 4.

There was sovereignty journalism by Aza, and then he threw in

Rodriguez as well, because we haven't had a chance to see

whether or not Rodriguez is that top.

All four of those horses are going to be in the Belmont.

So we're looking at maybe like a 6-7 horse field, but four of

them are the top four horses in the division.

You brought it up with Robert, by the way, for Mark Cassie to

throw him in. He's not a stakes winner, that's

a maiden winner, man. That shows how much effect

people have for what Baez's talent is.

Exactly right. No.

And it's, it's very obvious to people like Mark, Cassie.

I, I'm, I'm excited because I think we're going to not just

get a great Belmont because I do think that's going to happen.

I think Rodriguez is going to be on the lead and we're going to

see journalism right behind him and we're going to see

sovereignty right behind them. And Baez is in there.

We figured it out at some point. We got all four of those horses

in the same cripes, give me a Bellmont with those four.

I don't care. Like, let's figure it out.

I mean, for my betting book, that's so great, but let's

throw. The horse like Hill Rd. who he

hasn't really had the chance to show what he's made of yet.

He wins the Peter Pan. This is really going to be his

first opportunity to really show us what kind of talent that he

has. And so you throw him on top of

what we already got and yeah, I'm, I'm looking forward to it.

I'm excited. And then when that finishes, you

come back the very next day, hey here to Kentucky and you got 4

Kentucky Derby horses running in the Matt win stakes.

Incredible. Let's.

Go. I am with the Belmont and I know

I'm over too many mentions of this horse.

I apologize on this show, but Galster.

Oh yeah, when I heard he. Wasn't too many mentioned OK,

that horse? That horse which ran the race of

his life. Of the Preakness.

And when, for whatever reason, everybody jumped off of him

after the Lexington, we didn't. I know we, I know we both did

it. We both I.

Get to that. But that horse got me some

money, yeah. But I mean, he proved that he's

up there with the no. No, no, no, there's no doubt

about it. He's a legal one for sure.

But no, but that's another force that we get to add into this mix

at a high level. Yeah, right.

He might not be at that by as a level yet or at that, you know,

journalism kind of level yet. But had he won the Preakness, he

would have done all of the work and it would have been totally

deserved. Yeah.

Totally deserved. Yeah.

And so I that that's the other, by the way, underrated how fast

the Preakness was this year. Yeah, yeah.

Nobody really talked about. That no one talked about that

and the fact that journalism still closed into it, which is

impressive and the fact. But Goska was still rolling,

man. I mean he got tired at the end

for sure but. Unbelievable.

He was. Running strong.

Still, it'll be interesting because, you know, Walsh has E

Ave. pointed to the wind now and it'll be interesting to see what

Gosser's next step is. You know, we see the reports of

always go back to New York for things or whatever.

It will be interesting to watch because I do think there are so

many good options for these horses.

Well, the other part of it too is Godolphin.

Godolphin not only has E Avenue, they have sovereignty, right?

So you'd imagine, I would think, I would think Bill Mott would

keep sovereignty at Saratoga for the Jim Dandy.

Which then would make you think maybe E Avenue gets pushed

towards the Haskell at a mile underneath, unless they decide

to maybe shorten him up or something after the Matt wins.

Something like that. So then.

East Avenue will be second off the bench in that as well,

second in the form cycle. Then too.

Exactly. And it's a good timing after the

Matt win to be in the. Haskell.

I mean, all all things considered, sovereignty might

want another break. I don't.

Know Yeah, well, if that happens, then, you know, we'll

end up seeing where he ends up. But that does then, you know,

make an interesting decision for Walsh as far as where to put.

Gossgar. Yes, you know if E Avenue is

going to be in the Haskell. I know the Haskell has been

mentioned as a possibility for Gossgar.

Does Gossgar then end up in the Gym Dandy?

Does Gossgar end up in the Indiana Derby?

They there's a couple different options for.

Him, yeah, I think there are a lot of good options, frankly.

He's he's fascinating because I think that's a running style

that wins any kind of race. Yeah, right.

What he does, it wins everywhere.

It won in the short stretch at Keeneland.

It was almost a winner at Pimlico.

Like, that's a strut. That's just a a running style

that will work everywhere. And so Gosser's won if he shows

up and you leave him out of an exotic trifecta, kind of like

you're out of your mind. He just did the rest of the

year. Seriously, He feels, he feels a

lot like sees the Gray did last year, except he just doesn't

have that. He doesn't have the wins, yeah,

but a lot of like, oh, does he? Does he belong here?

And then Caesar Gray goes ahead and wins the Pennsylvania Derby,

too, right? He just, you know.

And by the way, by the. Way father's me.

Last year we gave Sierra Leone a pass for not liking Saratoga.

Nobody gave that no. One gave that Caesar Gray all at

all, and the second he got off that track and got to Parks, he

wins a grade one. I'll make sure.

He never got enough respect last year.

Well, obviously, but just the just we gave we give passes to

certain horses and not to others.

It sees the grain just it's a bomb take by people.

They need to be better. It's all the same.

By the way, if you are looking for a high level of success.

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Blood Horse Monday. Really appreciate the OBS folks.

They've been with us, frankly, since the very beginning of this

thing. So I do want to thank them and

want to thank, by the way, I don't think we ever thank people

who hang out with this show and we should start, Would it be?

It's fun. One of the things I like to do

on some of the other podcasts that I'm involved with is to

look up the most random place in the world that people are

listening from. OK.

And then just shout out that town like in Poland or

something. OK, Yeah, so are you.

I would love to do that odd here, but I'm only partners with

Blood Horse and I would need the OK for my partners with Blood

Horse. OK, yeah, that kind of thing.

Well, I I. Approve of it.

I think it's a great I. Don't know if I have that kind

of power to decide. That but or like shout out

someone who comments on YouTube or something like I, cuz we're

getting a lot of YouTube comments, which we appreciate by

the way, and I need to be better about replying to those.

But it's, it's no, it's fun. It's fun.

We're getting a little community around the show and I appreciate

it. Yes, yes, we appreciate you guys

watching, you guys listening, whether it be on YouTube or any

of the podcast sites, Spotify, anything like that.

Can watch us on Spotify as well on top of the YouTube viewing

opportunities. So if you want to know what we

look like, that's a great way to find out.

Although we don't blame you if you don't want to look at our

faces while you hear us, I'm surprised you want to hear our

voices. But it's a stunning, it's a

stunning. Reality.

Our voices are slightly better than our faces.

Speaking of community, we, we've lost, we've lost some, some

trainers unfortunately in the last week in our sport and we,

we get the note yesterday about Christophe Climal passing and.

Real surprising too, at least for me.

Yeah. And not someone that you and I

knew very well personally. But.

And I have to say, Sean, as a guy who I am older than you and

as a dad and all those things, you start to think about what it

might be like when you're not around just naturally with your

kids and to read. The man sat down and wrote his

own, Yeah, his own obit, essentially.

And it's beautiful. And it's about his family.

And it is about his legacy not mattering unless there was

someone to take it on. Yeah, and so Miguel's going to

step in his son. And I am so unbelievably

impressed by that post and the the forethought to write it.

Yeah. And to to to so his family can

have something forever to know exactly how he felt.

I mean, like he he like his his in law kids.

He mentions them glowingly. Can you imagine going on having

grandkids? He's not around, but like having

that note at least knowing exactly how he felt about you,

all of those things. Plus, frankly, and no one wants

to say this right after someone passes away, Christophe Lamal

was a damn fine trainer. Yeah, just is.

And, and, and so hopefully that legacy continues on because it

would be, it would be great if that barn continues to give us

many, many great horses around, you know, New York, East Coast,

etcetera, shipping all over the place for sure.

But just just wanted to mention him and just how as a dad,

especially, I appreciated the note because if, if, if that

were, you know, if my dad had written something like that or

if I'm able to leave something like that for my children, I'll

be really proud. Yeah, it was a powerful message

that that he that he posted or that he wrote up and, you know,

just seeing, you know, his love for the game, his love for his

family, how much doing the game with his family meant to him.

You know, he got his passion originally from his father and

he's now passed that down to his kids as well.

We just talked about family lineage when it came to the

broodmare side, but we were talking about puka.

But you know, you see that family lineage as well in the in

the people side. Yes as well.

And just hearing how much it meant to him, you know, I can't

imagine Miguel, you know, hit. Obviously this is a very tough

weekend for him. But just knowing that you had

the full support of your father, seeing those kind of words must

mean a lot to him, especially when you look at him going

forward. One of the things you always,

you know, we mentioned, I never had the chance to meet Kristoff

myself. But you know, one of the things

you always hear about Christoph was just how great of a horseman

he was, how much he really cared about the individual horses, how

he would try to build relationships with the

individual horses. And just, you know, the the

pride that he took in what he did every single day.

And he said to himself, it wasn't really work at the end of

the day, it was just him doing what he loves, surrounded by

people that he loved. And it was, you know, where it,

the sport needs people like Christophe in it.

And it's a huge loss for the industry.

It's a huge loss for his family, anybody that knew him.

But you know, he was just, he was such a great trainer.

He had such great success and you know, I was looking through

his information yesterday as far as the stakes wins.

I mean he averaged about 100 graded stakes wins every 10

years like that. That's incredible.

And he got his first grade stakes win within the first half

year he was training and so he was an incredible horseman.

He's leaving a lasting legacy and hopefully Miguel and the

team will be able to carry that on in the Clemont stables going

forward. But such a.

Huge loss for the industry. And I appreciate you bringing up

the fact that he's just a really great trainer.

Yeah, both things can be true. Could be a good dude, be a good

trainer. And it's so it's it's a shame to

to lose people of his ilk. Another person that we lost this

week and and someone that you and I do know you probably a

little better than me was, was Larry Demeret.

And I posted on Twitter photo I took of him just kind of

standing in a crowd. And I, and I, all I wrote was

it's how I'll always remember Larry.

He had that varsity jacket on with his name on it and Denver's

stables over here. And he was smiling and his teeth

were taller than he was for whatever reason.

Larry was a very diminutive man, but had the smile of a six foot

10 man. He just did.

I'm going to get emotional. And the barn is an interesting

spot, right? The, the, the backside of any

track is an interesting spot because it is busy.

It is. It's a touch chaotic all the

time because you're dealing with animals and some are going to

the tracks that are coming back from the track and there's

always kind of movement. You never felt that around

Larry? No, it was always calm.

It was always happy. It was always.

Now, were there serious moments worth it?

Sure. Of course, work needed to be

done, etcetera. But the the general tenor around

him was so positive. It was so easy.

Everyone wanted to be where he was and remember they had that,

that stall all the way at the back of Churchill where?

There was a grass area 42. There it is right all the way in

the back and and Dante, who you and I his his assistant that

we've gotten to know a little bit you better than me, just

that team. And and you know, Larry was the

first trader of color in 35 years in the Kentucky Derby and

we should not go 35 more years before that happens again.

And I don't, I'm not going to sit here and pretend that I have

the answers to that, but certainly meeting a guy like

Dante, meeting Horseman, like Dante and like Larry, we, I

don't know how that needs to come about, but it's something

that I certainly want to happen again in my lifetime numerous

times, frankly. And so I'm hopeful that we're

having those conversations as well.

But Larry, in general, I, I love the story that he tells of, oh,

I won the training title of the Bahamas twice.

And I was like, can't just stay here forever.

Yeah. What a need to go.

What a great just I'm so I'm so in awe of people that that pick

up their lives and just go figure it out.

And Larry's one of those guys picked up his life, figured it

out. Yeah.

And his, his reputation in Kentucky could not be better.

He just could not. And, and the driving force was

he watched the Kentucky Derby on TVI think I want to say it was

secretary, it's Kentucky Derby, but he saw it on TV and he's

like, I want to go be part of that.

And all the years that it took him, he finally got there in

2024 with W Saratoga. And just every day going back

there and seeing him that week leading up to it, just the huge

smile on his face, you could see how much he enjoyed it.

My favorite, one of my favorite quotes from him was when he was

talking about, you know, his disease that he's been dealing

with since the 90s. And when he said, well, I

learned that doctors can't count because they gave me 5 years to

live in the 90s, They gave me a couple months to live back in

like 2018. And here I am.

I'm still here and I'm still going.

And he just had such a positive outlook on everything.

He was always, you could tell how thankful he was to wake up

every morning, go see the horses, to have a horse like W

Saratoga and the barn to go see every single morning and.

He told the story. The doctor said you got to stay

overnight for treatment. He said I can't do that.

I got horses to. See, in the morning.

Exactly. Yeah.

That's just his love for the game, his love for, you know,

just what he did, and then his love to just share his story.

You know, you see a lot of people sometimes when they're

going through the things that he's gone through that, you

know, they, they don't really want to talk about it.

Or especially in a situation like the Derby where you're

getting asked about it every single day for a month leading

into it where you don't want to like you get tired of saying it

over and over again. But he was so happy to talk

about it every time because he knew that he was potentially

inspiring somebody else that was going through something similar.

And one, one of my favorite stories about Larry, I know I

told you this on another show that we did, but just to show

you the kind of person that he was.

You have all the chaos of Derby time going around.

He's got a horse running in the race.

You have, you know, everything that comes involved with that,

all the interviews and everything.

The Tuesday before the Kentucky Derby, I had my mom with me on

the backstretch. She was in town to go to the

Kentucky Derby and I took her over to see Larry because she

had heard about him and she wanted to meet him.

They, they talked for maybe like 5-10 minutes, but she told him

that she was visiting. Well, two days later, I'm, I'm

in the track kitchen at Churchill Downs and I see Larry

and he comes up to me, big smile on his face.

And the first thing he asks me is, oh, how's your mom enjoying

your trip? How is she doing?

How is she enjoying it? Is she having fun?

Like all the things that are on his mind?

He remembered that he met my mom.

He remembered that she was visiting.

He was interested to find out that she was still having a good

time, that she was enjoying herself.

And that that just shows the kind of person that he was.

The fact that everything that was going on in his life at that

point, all the chaos of the Derby and he still was thinking

about that. He remembered that was to me

that showed, you know, showed his character.

And I was lucky I got to see him Derby Week this year.

Have a quick conversation with him.

I know Derby last year, he never showed it, but I know it

physically took a huge toll on him.

But still, just to see his positive attitude every single

day after that was incredible. Rest in peace to both of those

gentlemen. Thank you for making our sport

better. That's all I can say is for that

because in very different ways, very different circuits, very

different manners, but both both certainly worthy and almost both

and but Larry man, just his presence here in Kentucky, very

personal for for both of us. And so may he rest in peace that

way. We're going to talk to Joe Perez

from Blood Horse. He's the managing editor.

We want to get his thoughts on the phase of Tipton sale and all

of the you know, man, the the increase, increase, increase is

the word in horse racing right now, especially at the sales.

So we'll get Joe's take on that. And here's my interview with Joe

Perez about the phase of Tipton sale.

And as promised, he is Joe Perez.

You can find him on the socials at BH under score, Jay Perez, if

you are so inclined to go find him there.

But of course, part of the sales team, great sales team we have

here at Blood Horse and bloodhorse.com was at the fasic

Tipton sale there at Simonium after the Preakness got to seize

on people being in town, I'm sure, Joe, but your your overall

sort of impressions of the sale early on, especially dealing

with some weather issues. Good morning.

Thanks for joining us and I'll leave it a little open like

that. Yeah, Louis, great to be here

and I appreciate you having me on to discuss the sale.

I think heading into the sale there were a lot of question

Marks and talking to consignors and even to people with Faceik

Tipton in the days leading up to it.

The, the tone was, I don't know, you know, they, they really

weren't sure what to expect because things were, were

changing almost by the hour because of the impact of rain in

the Timonium area, in the Baltimore area that week leading

up to the sale. I think starting the Monday

before. So we're going almost a full

week in advance of the sale through that Sunday.

Prior to the sale, I think there was only one day without rain

and in many cases it was torrential rain or just constant

rain. There was even a tornado warning

at one point. So the the impact on the track

at the Maryland State Fairgrounds was pretty

significant. And that contributed to a

breakdown midweek, which resulted in face of Tipton

having to have repairs done to the track and then ultimately

make the decision that they were just going to do Gallup only on

Sunday. And I, I think it was close to a

probably a 3070 split in terms of the number of of horses that

actually got to to breeze in the under tax show.

And I know, yeah, go ahead. I was going to say it.

I know there's a big difference especially at this particular

sale in total sale price between those that were able to breeze

and those that were able to gallop.

So the hand wringing ended up being deserved from some of the

ownership and and the the consignors.

Well, you know, I think that was one of the things I wanted to

monitor throughout the sale was just what the difference was

going to be and it ended up being about a $26,000 difference

for the horses that breezed compared to the ones that

galloped. However, it didn't stop people

from from going to the mat for some of the horses that were

gallop only. The second leading sales price

for a horse which came in 50,000 short of the top mark was a

horse that didn't breathe. So, but when, when you have the,

the, the, the pedigree, when you have the enough black type in

your catalog page, the, the buyers are going to go for you.

And, and we had that happen. So I think at the end of the

day, it ended up not being as big of a difference.

Although there are some consigners who would tell you

that if their horse did get to Breeze, I'm sorry if they did

get, yeah, if they did get to Breeze, they would have gotten

in their, in their estimation, a significant more return on on

their on their horse. We did see a Girvin Philly

attractive, you mentioned that the top earner here, 1.1 million

in these sales. I'm always amazed what happens,

Joe, once it gets going to the right people are in the room

when we get up to these kinds of numbers.

You've been sold previously, though, for pretty big numbers

at Keeneland as well. So I guess not a totally

stunning number here, but hey, million won for a Philly, that's

nothing to sneeze at. It it is nothing to sneeze at

and I think there were a lot of different things in play with

that particular purchase. I think the first thing was, is

that it was the first ever purchase for the Memo Racing and

Ammo Racing collaboration. So they they were willing to

make a statement and also that the buyer on hand, Carrie

Radcliffe along with Alex Elliott, they had a lot of faith

in what was coming out of the Wavertree consignment.

And to be honest, Wavertree knocked it out of the park

during this sale. They were easily the number one

consignor if if you look at the numbers they had, if you take

the the number 2 and #3 consignors, their total purchase

price of their consignment fell short of what Wavertree did.

And, and, and that's really tells you something about the

efforts that they're doing over there.

And Wavertree I believe had three of the top five off the

top of my head. I might be, I might be off just

a little bit or it was something close to that.

But they they definitely, from the consignment standpoint, made

their presence felt and the buyers loved what they had to

offer. You have a piece up right now

about Steve Asmussen Speaking of going to the bat for horses in a

partnership, Gus King, obviously the name on this one, but an

Uncle Mole coat. And you know, it's interesting,

Joe, and this is an obviously longer conversation for another

time, but you know, when when a sire passes away and that line

is left to that next group of progeny, I'm always interested

to watch what happens, especially in this kind of part

of the process. You know, we saw it last year

with, for example, like sees the Gray winning a couple of grade

ones. Well, once irrigated passed

away, that line was available for him to go to stud that way.

We see this Uncle Lowe Colt Gopher 975.

We know the the hopes and dreams of all of those in the in the in

the King and Asmussen camp. What do you think they liked

about this one? Well, you know, I think at the

end of the day, it still comes down to the pedigree.

And I think, you know, Steve didn't want to put Derby

aspirations immediately on, on this, on this cult.

So he, he really wanted to parse his words very carefully and

just basically say, when you have a horse like this, you get

to keep the dream alive. And that's, and I think that's

the same whether whether you're Steve Asmussen, Gus King, or

anybody else in the game, that's your dream.

And whether you're, you're dropping 40,000 on a horse or

900 plus for a horse, that's, that's the end game.

You're you're, you're, you're punching a ticket for a dream

and hoping that that dream comes to reality.

We see an Uncle MO Colt go for 975, We see a Nyquist go for a

million. We see a Gervin go for 1.1.

Is there another sire that that caught big money that you were

surprised to see? Or maybe you know these buyers

are trying to get in ahead of the curve.

Is there is there a sire out there that stood out at the

Fasig Tipton sale? Well, the one, the one that

really got to me really was the, the, the number 2 selling horse,

which was the violence cult. The, the conversation I had with

one of my colleagues was later in the, in the sale.

And, and the sale is also noteworthy because it went 12

hours or just short of 12 hours. So it was a bit of a marathon.

And one of the things in the years that I've covered this

particular sale is as you get later into the into the catalog,

most people have left. They're, they're not sticking

around. When they're done conducting

business, they're done. But the seats around the sales

ring were empty. But the ones that had bodies in

it were a lot of the top buyers from earlier in the day.

So you so you kind of knew something was coming, something

was brewing. And I had noticed that Donato

Lani had not made a purchase in the previous 11 hours.

And sure enough, he was the one who struck for this violence

cult. So it, it, it, you know, I think

it says something when, when the people who are really looking to

make a mark at a particular sale are the ones who are sitting

there waiting, bidding their time, and then they strike for

this big horse, you know, coming.

In. With 1,050,000.

Yeah, I was going to say I saw you, Joe, at the Preakness this

year, obviously Preakness 150, the final one at that rendition

of Old Hilltop. Lots of change coming to the

Maryland circuit in the future. This sale is is is a hallmark of

the Maryland, you know, horse racing year there.

With the Phasic Tipton sale at Timonium moving to a new

training ground there in Maryland, do you expect the sale

to stay at Timonium moving forward?

I do. I do think the sale will stay

there. I think there's a lot, there's a

lot that the buyers like about it.

I think it's very accessible for Mid-Atlantic, whether you're a

breeder, whether you're a consignor or an owner, it's just

a very accessible location. The other thing and it's been I

feel like a really strong point of the sale the last two years

is that the international buyers like the location, they like

that there's the dirt track. They have also made their

presence felt significantly over the last couple of years.

And I think, you know, if, if you're coming in from the Middle

East or from Europe, it's easy to get to, you fly into

Washington DC and, and you make the short drive.

And you know, we had, we had a group of Libyan owners who were

there recently formed group. I believe they spent 2.75

million on six horses, including two that were around 700,000.

So they were there, you had a lot of sheiks from Saudi Arabia

who who are not afraid to throw down their their dollars to find

the dirt horses that they want. So I think there's a lot to be

lost by changing locations. Mahmoud Mooney leading that

group's efforts on the ground here in stateside, at least in

it they were not shy about spending over $2.9 million at

the sale. So God bless them.

Let's get, let's go, let's get them all in here and keep it

rolling that way. Well, looking forward Joe, as

far as East Coast sales are are concerned, what should we be

looking for next? Well, I think the, the thing

that I'm curious to see is how this particular sale in Maryland

impacts anything with OBS June. You know, there, there were

several outs from, from this sale in Timonium where you have

to figure you have consigners who are redirecting those horses

to Ocala. There were even some consigners

who sold in Timonium who lamented whether or not if they

had saved that horse for, for Ocala, rather they would be able

to have gotten more money for that horse.

So now let's see what happens as we wrap up the 2 year old season

for sales and whether or not Ocala benefits from anything,

whether it's the scratches or the the very vigorous bidding

that we saw in Timonium. If Ocala can see that carry

over, we might see another record setting sale.

Joe Perez, find them at BH under score, Jay Perez on the socials,

of course, bloodhorse.com. There's a sales tab right at the

top, very easy to follow along with all of these things.

And I got to say, Joe, as a guy who came into this largely doing

handicapping shows and different things, the sales side has been

really fun to get to understand. It really is.

There's a lot going on. It's, it's wild.

And and I, I come from outside the industry and coming in and

trying to wrap my head around sales is, is it's different,

it's a work in progress. There you go.

All right, well, hey, and that's also it's a it's a holiday.

I appreciate it very much. You giving us a little bit of

time here on Blood Horse Monday. So that go, go be with your

family, Joe, get out of here. All right.

Yeah, it's my pleasure. There you go.

Joe Perez with us on Blood Horse Monday.

Appreciate him jumping on. Let's get Sean back in here.

We'll wrap up the show. We do it next.

All right, thanks for our colleague Joe Perez there at

Blood Horse. Bloodhorse.com, by the way, for

all of the sales information that you could ever possibly

want, we've got you completely covered over there.

Whether it be basic tipped or anywhere else, we've got you

covered for sure over there. It's fascinating stuff, the

sales and I did not. It's something I've come to

appreciate doing this show more is, you know, so much of my work

prior is about either storylines or about about handicaping.

Yeah, frankly, right. And so getting into the sales

side of things and you know, the interview to open the show with

Robert or the whatever it might be, it's it is it's been fun.

This is nice. It's nice to peel back the

curtains, get inside here and look around with them.

Exactly I. Mean when I grew up I was a

racing fan first and foremost and I always focus mostly on

that side. So that's one of the things that

now being with blood course has definitely opened my eyes to.

It's just, you know, this, this how much goes into the sales?

I mean, obviously you knew that there's a lot that goes into it.

But now seeing it first hand, hearing the stories of it.

I mean, we heard, we heard Robert earlier talk about, you

know, the decision that once you have a mayor that is produced at

Kentucky Derby, wonder how you have to kind of come to a

decision there about, you know, entering her in a sale, getting

the value of that. And you know, there's, there's a

lot that goes into it. And it's interesting, especially

a a sale like this where there was so much adversity kind of

thrown in the way for them to with the weather and everything

for them to bounce back. It's pretty, pretty remarkable.

Good stuff. Appreciate Joe jumping on with

us today. Big weekend coming up at

Churchill. Obviously today, big day at

Santa Anita. We will have a big day Stephen

Foster Preview day on Saturday at Churchill Downs by also.

Shout out to my my home state with the Pen Mile on Friday.

Well, pen mile talk pen. Mile Pen Oaks always love.

When I was in Pennsylvania that was always one of my favorite

race days to go to. So one of my favorite racing

memories is when catch a glimpse beat the boys in the pen mile.

A few years back. I love it.

The place went crazy. Were you there?

Yeah, I was there. Yeah, that was one of my

favorite racing experiences, experiences which is seeing the

fan base of Penn National freaking out as she came down to

stretch. It was awesome.

Shout out to Penn National. But if you are going out or

going to be betting on your phone, check out FanDuel Racing.

Download the app now and bet. Now with FanDuel Racing, we get

the Stephen Foster PV day. By the way, one of my favorite

things that's happened in horse racing the last four or five

years are preview days. Yeah, just give me all the

preview days. Haspel preview day.

Stephen Foster preview day. Kentucky Downs Preview day.

Give me all of them. Even if they're not at the track

that they're eventually gonna run.

The thing that they're previewing, I don't care.

Give. Me the And now we're getting the

Claiming Crown Preview day this year too at Colonial Downs.

Right here into my veins, you understand That's what I need.

I need all of it. Can you imagine the payouts on

claiming Crown preview? Day that's gonna be awesome I'm

really I'm really excited for that today it's I I I I fell

I've always liked the claiming crown but last last year when I

got to spend a lot of time talking to the connections I

really fell in love with the claiming crown last year and so

to now see a preview day coming up I'm.

Really excited once you're around all those HBPA folks from

different states who are all just slugging it out trying to

figure it out, you're like, OK, I get this.

Like, I totally understand this. Yeah.

And then they get to come to Churchill.

They get to, you know, if they win there on the twin Spires for

a win photo. So like, that's amazing.

Yeah, that's no, it's great. But the blame will be race 10

this weekend and we see the the Derby winner.

Speaking of Mystic Dan back in this spot.

I'm very excited about a different horse in here.

But bro, this came out great. This.

I mean this is salty. A great this is salty salty.

Yeah, right. And so any thoughts on this is

Mystic Dan, you know, is this I think the mile on an eighth is

probably about. What he wants to do, right?

I think this is going to be the race where we really find out

what we have with Mystic Dan this year because he had coming

off that long layoff, I, I tossed the Malibu out.

I don't think that distance is what he wanted to do at 7

furlongs. I think the trailering him from

that point from I guess where was it, Louisiana, probably at

all the way up to California. I don't think that was the right

choice to make. Well, it turned out to not be

that way, so I just. Didn't work out for whatever I

suggest. Right.

And then they. Try him in the.

Pegasus, yeah. Then they try him in the Pegasus

right back. After that, they stop on him.

He comes back and runs. Such a great race in defeat to

Saudi Crown, who's no sledge right at Oaklawn.

So I think now we get to find out is Mystic Dan back.

He's running out of his own stall at Churchill on a track

that we know that he likes obviously.

And if he runs great here, I think we're set up for him to

join the Fiercenesses and the Sierra Leone's as we in the

older horse division as we keep going throughout the year.

And if he doesn't run well in this spot, then we we kind of

know what we have with him at that point.

The forgotten horse in this field is Most Wanted, who ran

second to Fierceness running a track record of the Ali Sheba.

If Fierceness isn't in that race, I think he wins by open

lengths. He always shows up.

Ahead of Hall of Fame, by the way.

So I yeah, this is just another horse.

You were talking earlier in the show about this older horse, you

know, especially the male two term dirt division, whatever we

want to call it. Most wanted is one of those

horses for sure, a four year old son, a candy ride.

And I I just, I wonder if this isn't when he starts to have his

full breakout. Yeah, because this that he's got

a shot at the foster if he's in in form, right then they could

take a little bit of time off, maybe point to the Gold Cup,

something like that. And then obviously the Breeders

Cup would be on his on his Ledger, but you know, the speed

figures coming out of that one match up with anyone in the

older horse division that isn't named Pearson's to this point

this year. Exactly.

So I mean, at some point Most wanted is the not going to be a

forgotten horse. Frankly, I think he'll be a

pretty big favorite on Saturday. Yeah, and he was a late

developer last year. You know, he ended up wasn't the

Oklahoma Derby. I think that he ended up winning

he. Almost won the Clark as a three.

And he almost won the Clark, right?

And he comes back and he runs a very he ran a very strong second

to Skippy Longstocking, which also, by the way, was a track

record. And then he runs second.

So if you just got to be like shrugging, like, what do I do?

But congratulations. So if you're on 2nd, I guess

we're expecting a track record to fall this weekend at the mile

and an eighth distance here. Cuz apparently when he loses,

you break the track record. So you're the one is post time

in here. Oh yeah.

And he's coming out ran really, really well.

Obviously in the Breeders Cup they ran him out.

Then in the Cigar Mile didn't work out that well when he was

there. He just won an optional claimer

at at at Laurel. And I'm not exaggerating.

It was 13 1/2 lengths. It was it was the an absolute

workout. So I have nothing to base it on.

I'm just hoping he's in good form because he's a really

talented, really, really talented son of Frosted.

The thing about him that's interesting is it it stinks

because he'll never be as good as Nick's go.

So like the Maryland red thing isn't available to him, but man,

it's it's as far as the title of being the best one in recent

memory. But I he's got a chance.

If he can pick this race off especially, he'll be a really

good spot. Who knows, Nick's go got well,

he was good when he was younger but he he got way better as he

got older. Maybe post time will do the

same. You know what, I mentioned Gun

Runner earlier in the show. Nick's Go was way better

example. But of course, I'll be very

serious. We knew Gun Runner's ability at

three. We did not know that with Nick's

Go. Yeah.

I agree with that. I love Nick's go big, big Nick's

go fan, but I just I love what they do with post time because

they they look for the right spots to try him against the top

competition. And then when they need a

confidence booster or something like that, they just drop him in

and let him romp. And Maryland company.

And I, I said it's been such a yeah, it's been such a great

strategy and he's run so well and he hasn't picked up one of

these big wins yet, but he's run so well against this open

competition. And so it would be great to see

him have a breakout performance here in this spot.

And another thing with him too is, you know, he can go to one

turn, he can stretch out to these mile and eighths.

You know, he can run really in any of these spots.

And I just love seeing horses that do that.

It's kind of like the old time horses.

I would just go to wherever wherever the best spot was at

that point in time. It's interesting watching

Brittany Russell, the trainer here, manage his career too,

because he wins the Carter at 7 furlongs like you mentioned, but

she's trying to here at the mile and an eighth.

It looks sort of frosted. So mile and it shouldn't be an

issue as far as his breeding and different things.

But you know, just again, five year old horse, we get to watch

him develop, we get to watch him grow up.

Maybe he can develop into that two turn kind of horse.

I do think a mile and a is probably where he caps out.

I would think so, yeah. I.

Think the like the mile and 1/4 in the Breeders cup plastic.

Probably not for him Yeah, which is why I think that she tried

him in the the mile last year of the dirt mile.

But but no, he's this is this is a salty, salty grade 3.

For you really mentioned, you know, Hall of things.

We know there's always been a lot of a lot of high

expectations on him. We know Brooke Smith of Rocket

Ship Racing. He's very, very high.

Our favorite lunatic on this show?

Yes. He's probably watching Hello

Bro, but we know he's very high on him.

We also have a horse like Antiquarian who a lot of people,

he was kind of that that that now horse going into the

Belmont. Last year he didn't race for a

while after the Belmont came back, won his allowance race and

that was jumping back into stakes company here.

So it'd be interesting. To see how these Helios won a

grade three this year. Yeah, this is a field.

Horse like vanishing in there. Best actors got some back class

in him. That Katona, you know this is

for a grade 3 on a preview day. Let's have some fun.

This is a pretty good place. Had this field shown up in the

Stephen Foster, I would have been happy.

And so the fact that we're getting this in this preview for

the Stephen Foster and the blame, I think it's great.

And then you're gonna throw Sierra Leone in on top of this

field when we get to the end of the month.

I'm very excited for this week. It really is.

Again, if you are going to bet the races this weekend, please

check them out over at FanDuel Racing.

Download the up now, Get bet NOW with our friends at FanDuel

Racing. We appreciate them hanging out

with us here on Blunt Force Monday.

You and I are both devotes because we live here in

Louisville of Churchill Downs. You know, it's been really nice.

We haven't had to talk about the turf course at all and no, no,

no, no. I want to do something right now

because I've been critical of how that was hit managed or not

managed or whatever in previous years.

It hurt my soul when they didn't have turf racing at Churchill

Valves for many meets. Unfortunately, they are doing it

right right now and they deserve the kudos.

It looks great. The racing's been really fair.

Different types of horses can win, you know, different running

styles can win. They've done a great job.

It's been nice to not have to worry about that, so thanks a

lot. Yes.

There's no good way to say that they just no, but they deserve

the credit when when something positive's happening.

Good for you if you're criticizing but then also giving

credit when the problem gets fixed.

I just, a lot of people, I just want turf race to get Churchill.

That's all I'd love to know, but there's nothing like the

Saturday like this coming Saturday is, is an exception

because there's so many great stakes, but just a Saturday or

Sunday afternoon and you get that late pick four and it's a

turf route and then a dirt route and then a turf Sprint and then

a dirt Sprint. And you can have that, you know,

that melange of braces. I love that stuff.

And I'm spoiled by it because our home drag is Churchill

freaking Downs. Yeah, right.

Like that. That's a it's a heck of a way to

be spoiled. But I I just as a as a better

especially and someone who likes different kinds of races.

It's nice to be able to have all of those in the same sequel.

So it's nice to have those things back as well.

Well, he's Sean. I'm Louis.

Happy Memorial Day. Hopefully some time with your

family, some time away from work, whatever it might be as

far as those things. But of course, we always

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And of course, Blood Horse Daily, available at

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inbox. All of the top headlines around

the sport every single day from the great folks over at Blood

Horse. Thanks to Robert, thanks to Joe,

and of course, thanks to Sean for hanging out with me.

So on Blood HORSE Monday, we'll be back next week with another

edition of the show, getting ready for Belmont a little bit

closer by the time we get there, of course.

And we'll have a nice review of Stephen Frost for preview day

for Sean. I'm Louis, we'll see you in a

week. The Blood Horse is dedicated to

the improvement of thoroughbred breeding and racing for over 100

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For the latest news, analysis and insights, visit us at

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