Travers Stakes 2025 | Matthew DeSantis

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Friend of the show back with us this morning is Matthew DeSantis

joins us from up there in Saratoga Springs, NY ahead of

the 156th running of the Traverse tomorrow.

Matthew, we've been debating many things today, but the loss

of Hooters in America, do you also blame Donald Trump?

I don't see who else could possibly thank you.

You get it. So this is, yeah, this is the

travesty, really. They were dragging one up the

river and not toward my house the other day.

Matthew, It's not it's not what I need around here at all.

But there you go. Matthew just said it's that

failed to met us on the socials. Go find him there.

He's with naira bets and all the good things happening at the

naira as well on socials. If you want to go follow them

there. What's the what is what's

traverse weekend like? Does it have a different buzz

than the other weekends up there?

It does it still does. I mean Whitney Day, Whitney

weekends getting close, but Travers, there's just a little

bit of a different buzz. You know you and I can

appreciate the windows are open by the way the the weather's.

Beautiful up. Here for Travers day and it's

going to be beautiful tomorrow as well so we're going to be

fast and firm great racing and yeah absolutely abuzz.

You can already see it. We had a big crowd yesterday.

We had a huge crowd coming in today already lining up.

So it's going to be a lot of fun.

And you know, I think whether you want to lament the five

horse field or talk about it, the bottom line is we have an

opportunity to see this most special 3 year old that we've

seen I think in a little while. Run tomorrow and the last time

there was a 5 horse race in the traverse 1994 Holy Bull and

concern arguably the best renewal of the race in the last

40 or 50 years. So I'll I'll take a good five

horse race any day. Magnitude shows up, we could

have some fun there tomorrow. I've I've said for a long time,

I think Whitney Day I enjoy more than Traverse Day just because

the grass racing is so good that day and there's a real mix.

But frankly, if you're into just high level, really good dirt

racing, tomorrow's the day for sure.

The five grade ones in a row are just so back-to-back.

It's relentless. I mean, it's the first to the

eight challenge jerkins, to the ballerina, to the four go to the

Travers. These are phenomenal races with

tremendous fields. I mean, you talk about the eight

challenge jerkins, you can make a legitimate case for all 8

runners in that race. You look at the four, go with

book Em Dano, what a great story.

Everybody loves the personal Ensign with Anna.

She looks absolutely dynamite for Kenny Mcpeak right now.

But Leslie's Rose, randomized raging seat, Darth Vader, all

really legitimate contender. So it's going to be just an

amazing day of racing. Let's flip through some of

these. We're with Matthew DeSantis

final met failed to menace on the socials.

The personal Ensign starts the mandatory pay pick five races 9

through 13 tomorrow. So race 9 mile and an eighth on

the dirt grade one half million bucks in here for Phillies and

mares 4 and up. You mentioned some of the

rudders in there including, of course, torpedo Anna.

We'll see Darth Vader in here raging sea randomized the the

question I think one of the questions of the year that we we

don't ask a lot enough of I think frankly is how good is

torpedo Anna? Is she as good as she was at

three? You're telling me she looks

great. You expect her to run big

tomorrow? She is and and Louis.

This is kind of the first time I've gotten to see her up close

and in person. I just saw her yesterday paddock

schooling in the morning. It is as close to what she

looked like last year in the Travers physically in terms of

just the muscles popping, her energy level.

Kenny, I think has done a tremendous job managing her this

year and listen, is she going to win?

I think she is. But I what I know is she she's

going to run a big race and you're not going to get that La

Troy an effort again. I also think she draws really

well. Chad's horses are on the inside.

Remember, randomized, you know, kind of set it up for raging

seeing that La Troy Anne. That's not going to happen this

time around. She draws outside.

Brian Hernandez junior can keep her in the clear, keep her out

of trouble, keep her from getting bumped around.

I think she gets the right type of trip.

The horse that I'm actually most afraid of in that race is the

number 6 right inside of her Leslies Rose at 9:00 to 2:00

coming off a really nice race last time out in the shoe.

So that's one that I think it could absolutely continue to

move forward for Todd Fletcher and ran the exact same buyer

last time out. But listen, she she is the

goods. And, you know, there's not an

idiomatic, there's not a dare manner to really challenge her.

And so I understand why people ask that question, but I think

she's going to be good enough to get the job done tomorrow.

Race 10 will be the Jerkins. This is a three-year old Sprint

on the dirt. 7 furlongs there at Saratoga.

Half million bucks in this one as well.

And as you mentioned when we were leading into this, Matthew,

quite the field here, frankly. 3 Bafferts.

I didn't know that Saratoga needed Baffert to start propping

up their stakes races, but here we are.

It's a good joke for me or Brad Cox.

You're welcome. But no, it's a it's AI mean.

This is a who's who of the three-year old sprinter class

for sure. Patch Adams in here of course

Chancer. I really like Verifier in here.

I think he's going to be an interesting runner coming out of

the Maxfield here. Keeps Flavi and Pratt in them

out there. Where'd you land on this one if

you did? Yeah, I know I did.

It's a tough one to land on. I'll be honest.

Verifier, I agree with everything he said, and the fact

that Pratt stays aboard is a big deal because he he had the

opportunity to be on a few different horses in this race.

He opted to stay on that one. So I think that is serious.

I ultimately landed on Saratoga's own Chancellor

Mcpacker. The answer loves it up here at

the Spa. This is a horse that I was all

the way against in that curling last time out.

I didn't think Chad knew what he wanted to do with that horse in

terms of do we go long, do we go short?

But you know something that Woody Stevens was over a wet

track and I'm willing to draw a line through it a little bit.

Clearly they figured something out.

And more importantly, I Rat Ortiz Junior stays up and I rat

wrote him for the first time in that curling.

And I think something really clicked in in some ways.

I've never seen Chad Brown talk to a winning jockey as long as

he talked to I Rat after that curling.

And that was a really interesting dynamic.

And I think they figured something out with him

potentially. And I think he's sitting on a

big race, can sit behind the pace, but I think the other

other Bob of Midland Money at 8 to 1 is a little bit of an

interesting play as well. That horse clearly came up here

to really point towards the Jerkins after running an N1X

allowance up here and stayed up here.

So going to be a really fun one though, in that eight challenge,

Jerkins. Chancer Mcpatrick kind of

reminds me of domestic product last year where we saw him in

the Tampa Bay Derby and they tried to get him to go longer

and frankly, he went ahead and did it.

One wins in a mile and an eighth in that curling like you

mentioned and trying back in the Sprint here.

So would not be surprised to see see him have a nice day.

And tomorrow, Matthew DeSantis with us.

He's up there in Saratoga Springs ahead of the 156th

running of the traverse. Pick three leading into that

race starts with the Grade 1 ballerina in race 11/7 furlongs

on the dirt. Half million bucks here.

Phillies and mares, of course, 3 and UPS Philly mayor race

version of the four go, which we'll see in the next race.

You know, it's a grade one when majestic oops is 15 to one.

That's what I'll say. That's essentially where we're

at. Matthew, do you have one of the

ballerina? Yeah, I think Hope Road on the

outside Bob Baffert makes a lot of sense.

I think that one looks good. I just can't get behind Stila.

Who's your morning line favorite is five to two.

I understood the cutback when she made it last year for Bill

Mott, but she just hasn't won yet doing that and she just

feels like a horse that always seems to be running 2nd and 3rd

and I just can't get behind her as a favorite.

So I'm kind of fading her a little bit.

I think Hope Road makes a ton of sense.

I Bob has and getting this horse ready for this race that you see

those 6 furlong bullets and that usually means run to the windows

and bet with both hands. And so yeah, I think he's got

this one all tuned up for this race.

I think my main squeeze at 5 to 1's a little bit interesting.

I think Sappy's horse Clarey Beret at six to one's a little

bit interesting. You mentioned Majestic oops at

15 to one another really loaded field.

And like I said, I'm just willing to get past Zilla and I

think it opens up a little bit after that.

You know bright work is in here. She's 3 for three lifetime at

Saratoga, and certainly not in crappy races.

She won the freaking spin away in 2023, right?

So it's, yeah, good. I talked to Johnny Ortiz about

this horse back in April and he goes she loves New York because

she loves it up here. I think she runs a much better

than the 15 to one odds on the morning.

Yeah, just most recent run was in August last year in the

priors in a grade 3 under Louis sizes gets the win there.

Johnny Velasquez will have them out for her.

Yeah, her and Majestic oops. I'm looking really, really

closely at because I thought majestic oops in the pitcher,

just it was a little bit too long and I think this distance

will be just right for her, the mile and a 16th, just a little

bit too much of Monmouth. Yeah, no, I think that's the key

is, I mean it's so interesting. That's what makes the jerkins,

the ballerina, all these races so interesting is like these

horses that just cut back, they're like, ah, 16th is not

quite enough or like a little too much.

All right, let's get the seven furlongs and you can see them

when they really pop. And so I love these dirt Sprint

races for both the boys and the girls.

It's just my favorite division. There you go.

Speaking of the boys, we go to the four go race 12.

It's a grade 17 furlongs on the dirt here, half 1,000,000 bucks

on the line. This is for four and up because

of course we just had jerkins for three-year olds.

Let's get into this one here. Most wanted Bishop's Bay, I

think is a really interesting entry coming out of that

Salvatore mile getting back to the the seven furlongs here.

But of course, book em Dano is in here.

We just watched Paco Lopez have a day yesterday at Colonial.

He really does seem to be on top of his game.

He was excellent the Friday before the the Haskell when we

were there in New Jersey. What do you make of Bucum Dano?

Is he not? Is he the single in this

sequence? Potentially?

I potentially, I mean, I think the single might be in the next

race, but I think that the, but without giving too much away,

but I, I think that he is a worthy single.

I will say that he's a worthy single in this race.

He is a horse that just answers the bell every single time.

His only loss this year was by a neck and that was to mind frame

Nicos and Vanishing. Hello, that's pretty good.

That's incredible company. I you know, it's so interesting

about Bishop Spay and most wanted, the 2 Cox horses on the

inside. They both have really good

speed. I wonder if they have enough

speed to get their preferred trip going 7 as opposed to going

a mile or a mile on a 16th. I think that's a little bit of a

question mark. I the rail draw for most wanted

is a little concerning, but you're talking about two horses

there that have never been out of the exact in their careers.

So it's just incredibly consistent for me, book them

down becomes that much more difficult to beat because I just

don't trust Mullican at all. This is a horse that just every

time at the top of the stretch, I think it's the time and then

every time you lose and I just can't with this horse 7:00 to

2:00. So I just can't keep giving him

chances. It's a little bit of a different

dynamic than what we saw a few years ago.

Gunite and elite power. So for me it's book him Dano in

this race. And I'll be honest, the big

price I like is Scotland for Bill Mott.

I think that horse is sitting on a big race at 12 to one.

Yeah, it's a. Lot of buzz around Scotland when

he was a younger horse, certainly winning, you know, at

high level, both at Saratoga and at Churchill.

They tried him in the traverse in 2023, up the track a little

bit behind Archangelo. But yeah, yeah, it is a

fascinating group of of runners here as well.

But let's move into that traverse.

Do you know much about Mr. Traverse?

I I don't know much about Mr. Traverse.

OK, so William Riggin Traverse was a successful American lawyer

who made his money on Wall Street.

How about that? He was born in 1819 in Baltimore

and died in Bermuda in 1887. How about that?

My man was traveling. That's my type of life right

there. No, that's exactly it.

So there you go, A bunch of kids obviously into horse racing as

well. Violet 1/4.

We're going to classic folks. 10 furlongs here, $1.25 million on

the line. Group of five here in this one.

So we'll go, we'll go. Bulls embarrassed since he made

all of his money on the on Wall Street here.

Magnitude in this one will break from the inside.

Ben Curtis making the trip up for Steve Asmus and winner of

both the Risen Star and that might have been frankly of all

the performances we had on the Derby trailer, it might have

been the Oh my goodness performance.

Winning by 9 plus lengths in the Risen Star comes back in the

Iowa Derby wins by 9 plus lengths.

Is there a world in which he wins this race?

Bulls or bears here? I'm on bears with him and I

there's a world in which he wins the race for sure, but not a 2

to one that because what 2 to one says is he wins this race

1/3 of the time and you know, get the heck out of here.

He's not winning this race 1/3 of the time.

So, you know, can you win this race 10 times out of 100?

Maybe I just don't think he can get a mile and a quarter.

You know, when I look through the real, the the just the

variable who's who, of course, is he beat that Iowa Derby, You

know, certainly not the 1927 Yankees.

And it's, you know, and then you look at who he beat and the

Risen Star and you go, OK, Chunk a goal is a nice horse.

And you know, American Promise went on to win the Virginia

Derby and OK, then did nothing after that.

And that was the day they also intentionally raided E Avenue to

see if that horse could do it. And the answer was a definitive

no. And so I just, I, I just am not

overwhelmed. And I know the horse has gotten,

you know, the two really big buyer speed figures, but I just

don't, I don't love his action. I don't love the way he moves.

And I think in a mile and 1/4, this is all Sovereignty's game.

So I, I'm, I'm very bearish on him.

I, I just do not see the hype, especially at the 2 to one

morning for online price. That's the thing that traps

trips me up is I just can't support him at that price.

Bracket Buster will break from the two we had BBN racing on

Blood Horse Monday. Cool story with this horse and a

local interest for the blue and white fans around here in

Bracket Buster. Luis Saez picks up them out

here. He did win the Pegasus over

Sloppy Go at Monmouth earlier this year.

Bears are bulls for him. Bears But I like him.

He's he's a nice horse. I just think he's outclassed in

the spot and I think he's actually going to be a really

pivotal horse in this race because he is absolutely going

to be able to apply some pressure.

I think the magnitude in the early going and that would not

shock me at all if he kind of makes sure the magnitude maybe

doesn't get away up front. But bears on his chances.

But very cool horse and I'm glad Vicki Oliver is bringing him up

here to run. Brackenbuster was second in the

Lexington behind Gossgar, who was second in the Preakness and

of course most recently in the Haskell as well.

Strategic Focus keeps Flavian Pratt in the mount.

He was second in that curling behind Chancellor Mcpatrick.

Last out. Chad Brown trains here.

We're going bears or bulls for a horse.

Throwing the blakers on in Strategic Focus.

I'm going bulls. I'm like strategic focus.

I think if there's an upset bit in this race, it's him.

Gun runner out of a Kerlin mare should be able to run for days.

Only a sports career start. I love young horses that are

moving up. Last time out in the Kerlin, you

know, made a winning move and just flattened out a little bit

in the lane. Finished third behind

Chancellor. And so Sandy and I think the

blinkers are going to help. I think additional conditioning

is going to help. This is the horse's 4th career

start and he's beaten older horses already.

And that one O 2 buyer speed figure you might see on the

page, that's a real number because the horse he beat that

day, Millar Truck came back to run another one O 2 the next

time out. So he's a horse that I think is

really serious, can sit the right sort of trip just tracking

behind that early pace of bracket Buster and magnitude.

I'm very bullish on strategic focus, especially 6 to 1.

By the way, that Curlin, that he was in, was 110th of a second,

110th or no, excuse me, 1/5 of a second, excuse me, slower than

the Jim Dandy that sovereignty won.

Junior Alvarado keeps them out here of course, as he should.

The oldie missing the Florida Derby of course, with this horse

who broke his maiden as part of that 2 year old program at

Churchill Downs in a race called the Street Signs.

You understand me? That's what this is.

But sovereignty, look at me making it local.

Sovereignty comes in of course at 2:00 to 5:00.

What do you think he actually goes off at?

I think probably one to five, I would imagine.

I don't think 1:00 to 9:00, there's too much hype around

magnitude, but I think one to five in all likelihood.

All right, one to five on sovereignty.

Is that a good bet or not? Probably not a good bet at 1:00

to 5:00. A good bet at 2 to 5, though.

I take 2 to 5. OK.

Take your $0.40 there and we're going bulls with him.

Why? Yeah, we're going bulls.

Hey, listen, this horse is the nuts.

This horse is just this is the real deal, you know, journalism.

And listen, I've been trying to beat him almost every single

race. This the only time I was right

was with Tapan St. in the Florida Derby.

But I I, you know, I was the biggest supporter of journalism

during the Triple Crown trail and journalism by most accounts

is one of the most physically impressive horses you will see.

And sovereignty went by him with just junior shaking the rain.

That's The thing is that this horse has just done it so easy.

We've rarely ever. It's the same thing we saw last

year with Anna when she was beating horses.

She was just doing it with Brian, barely asking her for

anything. And the reality is we have yet

to get to the bottom of Sovereignty.

This horse hasn't been asked the way that all these other horses

are being urged for their absolute best.

And I think he's going to put on a show on Saturday and I think

Magnitude's going to see that 8th pole and go, wait, you're

telling me there's more and it's going to tap out.

And then at that point, Sovereignty is just going to put

on a show. I think he's going to win by

double digits tomorrow. I I just think he's that good of

a horse and I think we see that special of a performance.

Matthew DeSantis with us from up there at Saratoga Springs.

McAfee will round out the field a frankly a decent second last

out at at Mountaineer in the West Virginia Derby before that

did go a mile and an eighth in the Ohio Derby was one of the

three in that final run. I'm going to go, I'm going to

assume bears here. But he did.

I mean, frankly looked OK the Peter Pan.

This isn't a horse without talent.

Yeah, Yeah, it is. I I think I, I'm bears here.

But you know, if you're talking about an underneath play cool.

And so this is a horse that just has a tendency in a knack to run

into things. And just like you're like, how

did McAfee finish third goal? I don't know, but he did.

And so I, you know, again, could I see a scenario where this

horse is in the trifecta? Absolutely.

Where, you know, a couple of these horses want no part of a

mile and a quarter. McAfee just kind of keeps

staying on and next thing you know, you look at the final, you

know, you look at the, you know, the tote board and you go wait a

second. McAfee finished third.

Yeah, I could absolutely see that being the case.

So he's a much like bracket Buster.

He's a nice horse who I really like.

I think he's a little outclassed in this spot, but I think he's

going to run well. He's Matthew DeSantis at there

at failed to menace. Excuse me on the socials.

Go find him there as well. What's the what's the outfit for

tomorrow? You've been I'm very proud of

you. You're you're not a dad, but

you've been dressing like 1 and I I've been very it's almost

like Kaylee is, is pushed you into the next phase of life.

Middle age pattern shirts, these sorts of things.

It's it's been very nice to watch.

What are we wearing tomorrow? Well, when you're when your main

colleague is 24 years old, you are reminded that you are not

going anymore. Yeah, I decided not to.

What am I wearing tomorrow? It's not, you know, we're not

doing anything like floral patterns, so we're not going to

hold that. But we are going to wear, you

know, something probably a little gingham and a little bit

of a like a plain tie and khaki slacks.

Very, you know, traditional, look, probably going to have

some blue pork, a dolphin and sovereignty just does a little

bit of good luck. But yeah, it's going to be,

listen, it's going to be a fun day and it's going to be one of

those days that, you know, people, it's what makes Saratoga

great these days like tomorrow. So me and 45,000 of my closest

friends are going to be having a lot of fun up here at the spa.

Well, he's Matthew DeSantis at the AT failed to met us on the

socials. He's up there at the naira as

well. You can find everything they're

working on. Happy traverse weekend buddy.

We'll talk to you soon. Thank you so much, Louie.

Take care. There you go, Matthew DeSantis

with us. So, so generous with his time

there. A quick break here on the other

end. Zach and I will get into George

Costanza bobbleheads. I this thing terrifies me.

We talk about it next.